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God sucks!

Started by Locutus, May 09, 2007, 09:20:54 PM

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Exterminator

Quote from: Henry Hawk on April 30, 2009, 02:14:43 PM
God is not anywhere mentioned in the Book of Esther in the Old Testament...but it is clear His hand was throughout it....as many Americans believe that God's hand is clearly written in the Constitution...though He is not mentioned.

Your "proof" is an analogy between a fairy tale and our Constitution?  That logic is as circular as 'the bible is true because it says in it that it's true'.
Arguing with Christians is like playing chess with a pigeon.  No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, shit on the board and strut around like it's victorious.

The truth is slow, but relentless. Over time it becomes irresistible.

Henry Hawk

Quote from: Exterminator on April 30, 2009, 02:24:22 PM
Quote from: Henry Hawk on April 30, 2009, 02:14:43 PM
God is not anywhere mentioned in the Book of Esther in the Old Testament...but it is clear His hand was throughout it....as many Americans believe that God's hand is clearly written in the Constitution...though He is not mentioned.

Your "proof" is an analogy between a fairy tale and our Constitution?  That logic is as circular as 'the bible is true because it says in it that it's true'.

Just pointing out an observation....that's all.
"The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left."
Ecclesiastes 10:2 - It all makes sense to me now...


"The future ain't what it used to be."– Yogi Berra

"Square roots are rarely found on any plant." FTW

Exterminator

Quote from: Henry Hawk on April 30, 2009, 02:41:47 PM
Quote from: Exterminator on April 30, 2009, 02:24:22 PM
Quote from: Henry Hawk on April 30, 2009, 02:14:43 PM
God is not anywhere mentioned in the Book of Esther in the Old Testament...but it is clear His hand was throughout it....as many Americans believe that God's hand is clearly written in the Constitution...though He is not mentioned.

Your "proof" is an analogy between a fairy tale and our Constitution?  That logic is as circular as 'the bible is true because it says in it that it's true'.

Just pointing out an observation....that's all.

It's ridiculous.
Arguing with Christians is like playing chess with a pigeon.  No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, shit on the board and strut around like it's victorious.

The truth is slow, but relentless. Over time it becomes irresistible.

mcgonser

The Separation Of Church and State

The phrase "separation of church and state" does not appear anywhere in the Constitution. Thomas Jefferson wrote that the 1st Amendment erected a "wall of separation" between the church and the state (James Madison said it "drew a line," but it is Jefferson's term that sticks with us today). The phrase is commonly thought to mean that the government should not establish, support, or otherwise involve itself in any religion. The Religion Topic Page addresses this issue in much greater detail.
Thanks to Pat Roche for the idea.
http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html
Thats my story and I'm sticking to it!

Henry Hawk

Quote from: Exterminator on April 30, 2009, 02:56:26 PM
Quote from: Henry Hawk on April 30, 2009, 02:41:47 PM
Quote from: Exterminator on April 30, 2009, 02:24:22 PM
Quote from: Henry Hawk on April 30, 2009, 02:14:43 PM
God is not anywhere mentioned in the Book of Esther in the Old Testament...but it is clear His hand was throughout it....as many Americans believe that God's hand is clearly written in the Constitution...though He is not mentioned.

Your "proof" is an analogy between a fairy tale and our Constitution?  That logic is as circular as 'the bible is true because it says in it that it's true'.

Just pointing out an observation....that's all.

It's ridiculous.

in your opinion...
"The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left."
Ecclesiastes 10:2 - It all makes sense to me now...


"The future ain't what it used to be."– Yogi Berra

"Square roots are rarely found on any plant." FTW

mcgonser

Amendment 1 - Freedom of Religion, Press, Expression. Ratified 12/15/1791. Note

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html

It has often been seen on the Internet that to find God in the Constitution, all one has to do is read it, and see how often the Framers used the words "God," or "Creator," "Jesus," or "Lord." Except for one notable instance, however, none of these words ever appears in the Constitution, neither the original nor in any of the Amendments. The notable exception is found in the Signatory section, where the date is written thusly: "Seventeenth Day of September in the Year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and Eighty seven". The use of the word "Lord" here is not a religious reference, however. This was a common way of expressing the date, in both religious and secular contexts. This lack of any these words does not mean that the Framers were not spiritual people, any more than the use of the word Lord means that they were. What this lack of these words is expositive of is not a love for or disdain for religion, but the feeling that the new government should not involve itself in matters of religion. In fact, the original Constitution bars any religious test to hold any federal office in the United States.
Thanks to James MacDonald for the idea.


Thats my story and I'm sticking to it!

Locutus

Quote from: Exterminator on April 30, 2009, 02:24:22 PM

That logic is as circular as 'the bible is true because it says in it that it's true'.


That's true!  :biggrin:
One of the gravest dangers to the survival of our republic is an ignorant electorate routinely feeding at the trough of propaganda.   -- Locutus

"We are all connected; To each other, biologically. To the earth, chemically. To the rest of the universe atomically."  -- Dr. Neil deGrasse Tyson

LOsborne

Loud applause for mcgonser for providing that valuable link (I bookmarked it) as well as for quoting excerpts from it.

Mcgonser, I've only been here a couple of weeks, but from what I've seen, you are one heck of a good sport.

mcgonser

Thank You Lo: I will take all the compliments I can get. LOL  ;D :biggrin: :yes:
Thats my story and I'm sticking to it!

dan foster

Quote from: mcgonser on April 30, 2009, 03:39:01 PM
The Separation Of Church and State

The phrase "separation of church and state" does not appear anywhere in the Constitution. Thomas Jefferson wrote that the 1st Amendment erected a "wall of separation" between the church and the state (James Madison said it "drew a line," but it is Jefferson's term that sticks with us today). The phrase is commonly thought to mean that the government should not establish, support, or otherwise involve itself in any religion. The Religion Topic Page addresses this issue in much greater detail.
Thanks to Pat Roche for the idea.
http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html

Does the Constitution identify the God, Thor as the almighty?
"Wherever morality is based on theology, wherever right is made dependent on divine authority, the most immoral, unjust, infamous things can be justified and established." -- Ludwig Feuerbach, The Essence of Christianity, 1841

"A bottle of wine contains more philosophy than all the books in the world" Louis Pasteur

"It is a truism that almost any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so." -- Sir Arthur C. Clarke

dan foster

Quote from: mcgonser on April 30, 2009, 03:39:01 PM
The Separation Of Church and State

The phrase "separation of church and state" does not appear anywhere in the Constitution. Thomas Jefferson wrote that the 1st Amendment erected a "wall of separation" between the church and the state (James Madison said it "drew a line," but it is Jefferson's term that sticks with us today). The phrase is commonly thought to mean that the government should not establish, support, or otherwise involve itself in any religion. The Religion Topic Page addresses this issue in much greater detail.
Thanks to Pat Roche for the idea.
http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html

So what is your point?  That church and state should join together?  I think you will find Jefferson's, et al, intent clearly from his own mouth:

"History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes." --Thomas Jefferson to Alexander von Humboldt, 1813. ME 14:21
"Wherever morality is based on theology, wherever right is made dependent on divine authority, the most immoral, unjust, infamous things can be justified and established." -- Ludwig Feuerbach, The Essence of Christianity, 1841

"A bottle of wine contains more philosophy than all the books in the world" Louis Pasteur

"It is a truism that almost any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so." -- Sir Arthur C. Clarke

mcgonser

I wasn't addressing Jeffersons intentions or thoughts, just what is actually written. To me it is clear that they (all) who agreed to sign, that the government should keep its nose out of all church and religious dealings. To repeat myself, because in Europe where they came from the gov or monarchy ran the Church's and ruled over them. They wanted true freedom to worship or not to worship without persecution.
Thats my story and I'm sticking to it!

dan foster

Quote from: mcgonser on April 30, 2009, 09:49:09 PM
I wasn't addressing Jeffersons intentions or thoughts, just what is actually written. To me it is clear that they (all) who agreed to sign, that the government should keep its nose out of all church and religious dealings. To repeat myself, because in Europe where they came from the gov or monarchy ran the Church's and ruled over them. They wanted true freedom to worship or not to worship without persecution.

Wow.  You did get it. 
"Wherever morality is based on theology, wherever right is made dependent on divine authority, the most immoral, unjust, infamous things can be justified and established." -- Ludwig Feuerbach, The Essence of Christianity, 1841

"A bottle of wine contains more philosophy than all the books in the world" Louis Pasteur

"It is a truism that almost any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so." -- Sir Arthur C. Clarke

LOsborne

Quote from: dan foster on April 30, 2009, 09:32:25 PM
Does the Constitution identify the God, Thor as the almighty?
Bite your tongue, Dan! His Noisiness already has delusions of adequacy. Calling him the Almighty is like naming a five-year-old with a Bob-the-Builder set as Supreme Being.

Exterminator

Arguing with Christians is like playing chess with a pigeon.  No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, shit on the board and strut around like it's victorious.

The truth is slow, but relentless. Over time it becomes irresistible.