In other news, "19 Kids and Counting" has been officially canceled. :yes:
Quote from: Locutus on July 16, 2015, 01:45:38 PM
In other news, "19 Kids and Counting" has been officially canceled. :yes:
Good. Now maybe they will cancel the other show called Bates or something like that where they have as many kids!
Any show that glorifies societal irresponsibility, like those folks so greatly personify, should be canceled. It should have never gone on for a long as it did to begin with.
Of all those reality shows, I liked that one. I thought it was interesting how the was able to function. There is no irresponsibility with them, they completely was accountable and very loving to those kids. I despise those who bash them. They paid there own way and didn't count on others for hand outs.
But with that said, I don't blame TLC for dropping them....the boy screwed up and now they are paying the price.
Societal irresponsibility Hank; that's what you're not getting. I know they're legally allowed to have a kid every time they decide to fuck, but should they?
There show and probably the Bates people are part of a Quiver movement which is like a cult in my opinion. Look it up, they think the women are just a bunch of brood cows!
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 16, 2015, 08:54:00 PM
Of all those reality shows, I liked that one. I thought it was interesting how the was able to function. There is no irresponsibility with them, they completely was accountable and very loving to those kids. I despise those who bash them. They paid there own way and didn't count on others for hand outs.
But with that said, I don't blame TLC for dropping them....the boy screwed up and now they are paying the price.
Henry, they didn't even raise their kids! The older ones take care of the younger ones. How is that being loving parents?
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 16, 2015, 09:05:03 PM
Henry, they didn't even raise their kids! The older ones take care of the younger ones. How is that being loving parents?
have you even watched their show? Of course they raised their kids, they had plenty of help, but they are good kids!
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 16, 2015, 09:34:11 PM
have you even watched their show? Of course they raised their kids, they had plenty of help, but they are good kids!
Yes, I watched a few shows but having older kids take care of younger kids is not being a parent/s. Like I said they are a part of a cult! How is it being good kids when you have a perp and victims?
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 16, 2015, 10:38:47 PM
Yes, I watched a few shows but having older kids take care of younger kids is not being a parent/s. Like I said they are a part of a cult! How is it being good kids when you have a perp and victims?
What cult? That family is amazingly normal, considering being as large as they are. I think it was interesting on how, they built their house. They way they shop. Everything was sort of interesting. I had five kids and that could be overwhelming at times....so, I found this quite interesting. They all seem very well adjusted, bright and intelligent.
I think the rub with many people, and I'm not accusing you of this, but many don't like them because of they very, very strong faith in God that they have.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 09:06:48 AM
What cult? That family is amazingly normal, considering being as large as they are. I think it was interesting on how, they built their house. They way they shop. Everything was sort of interesting. I had five kids and that could be overwhelming at times....so, I found this quite interesting. They all seem very well adjusted, bright and intelligent.
I think the rub with many people, and I'm not accusing you of this, but many don't like them because of they very, very strong faith in God that they have.
Have you looked up Quiver Movement? It is a cult to some degree and what they are part of. They treat the women as if all we are are a bunch of cows here to populate the world. I don't see that as having a strong faith in God at all!
By the way, I had a classmate who had 13 brothers and sisters and her mother and father raised the kids and didn't expect the older siblings to raise the younger ones! I had cousins who were a big family of 9 and they didn't either. I don't see any of them as being bright or intelligent when you have a perp who has molested victims and no help for the victims so to speak!
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 09:54:21 AM
Have you looked up Quiver Movement? It is a cult to some degree and what they are part of. They treat the women as if all we are are a bunch of cows here to populate the world. I don't see that as having a strong faith in God at all!
By the way, I had a classmate who had 13 brothers and sisters and her mother and father raised the kids and didn't expect the older siblings to raise the younger ones! I had cousins who were a big family of 9 and they didn't either. I don't see any of them as being bright or intelligent when you have a perp who has molested victims and no help for the victims so to speak!
I bet you dollars to doughnuts that those kids you spoke of had big brothers and sisters that did a tremendous amount of help with those little bros and sis's....I know my Dad had six brothers and one sister...and she did a lot, as far as helping mom and dad with the kids....it is called being a family. Just because the Duggars had 19.....doesn't mean they were not great parents.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 10:04:21 AM
I bet you dollars to doughnuts that those kids you spoke of had big brothers and sisters that did a tremendous amount of help with those little bros and sis's....I know my Dad had six brothers and one sister...and she did a lot, as far as helping mom and dad with the kids....it is called being a family. Just because the Duggars had 19.....doesn't mean they were not great parents.
You would lose! Like I said both were big families and the older ones didn't help with the younger ones. My mom came from a family of 9 and the older ones didn't help at all with the younger ones.
No, when you allow abuse to happen in your home and you know about it, that isn't making you a great parent/s but the worst parent/s possible!
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 10:13:04 AM
You would lose! Like I said both were big families and the older ones didn't help with the younger ones. My mom came from a family of 9 and the older ones didn't help at all with the younger ones.
No, when you allow abuse to happen in your home and you know about it, that isn't making you a great parent/s but the worst parent/s possible!
I'm sticking with my own thoughts here, but really believe it has MORE to do with people not liking them because they were devout Christians than them being bad parents. I think they did a wonderful job of parenting. They handled their son pretty effective. It is the media making him and the parents out to be some monsters.
THAT is my thoughts...and YOU have yours.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 10:41:35 AM
I'm sticking with my own thoughts here, but really believe it has MORE to do with people not liking them because they were devout Christians than them being bad parents. I think they did a wonderful job of parenting. They handled their son pretty effective. It is the media making him and the parents out to be some monsters.
THAT is my thoughts...and YOU have yours.
No, most normal parents would have pursued charges, yes, even if it meant on their own child and most normal parents would have gotten help for the victims. I don't consider them good parents but actually attention whores.
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 11:38:07 AM
No, most normal parents would have pursued charges, yes, even if it meant on their own child and most normal parents would have gotten help for the victims. I don't consider them good parents but actually attention whores.
And that is what most Christian Bashers are saying right now about them.....
Now, are they attention whores? Hard for me to argue with you on that, because they put themselves into the limelight, and they get what ever comes at them. They made the choice to go on TV and display their family and lifestyle with the world...so, I'm not protecting them. I just have my own opinion, based on watching several episodes of them. Those kids look pretty damn good to me. They seem very happy and very well mannered. That's all I got.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 12:08:22 PM
And that is what most Christian Bashers are saying right now about them.....
Now, are they attention whores? Hard for me to argue with you on that, because they put themselves into the limelight, and they get what ever comes at them. They made the choice to go on TV and display their family and lifestyle with the world...so, I'm not protecting them. I just have my own opinion, based on watching several episodes of them. Those kids look pretty damn good to me. They seem very happy and very well mannered. That's all I got.
Probably only well mannered when the public eye is on them but I highly doubt they are that good all the time. I could care less about their religious beliefs but I can guarantee that as a parent if my son was molesting his sister, I would file charges on him so quick his head would spin and get the help she would need! Any decent parent would do that!
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 12:56:10 PM
Probably only well mannered when the public eye is on them but I highly doubt they are that good all the time. I could care less about their religious beliefs but I can guarantee that as a parent if my son was molesting his sister, I would file charges on him so quick his head would spin and get the help she would need! Any decent parent would do that!
What do you think this kid did? Tell me. Wait, I will tell you, he was 12 years old, and he touched his sisters and their friends boobs, on a few occasions, while they were asleep. The girls never even knew it, until he told his parents, and they then told his sisters. He never ever was sexual with them....he never tried to have sex with them....he was a goofy 12-year old that, never went to public school and he he let his demons get the best of him...and he was copping a feel.
I'm not making light of this or saying what he did was okay.....but, the word "molestation" can mean many things....THAT is why his parents tried to handle this themselves at first, then when he said that he, himself was worried....they seeked counseling....then, they went to the police on there own.
They didn't have to do anything...but they did. Now, the Son is probably going to have a very rough way to go.....they family will have a rough way to go.....
But, like I said earlier....they are the ones that chose to be on TV....so, this is what can happen.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 01:24:20 PM
What do you think this kid did? Tell me. Wait, I will tell you, he was 12 years old, and he touched his sisters and their friends boobs, on a few occasions, while they were asleep. The girls never even knew it, until he told his parents, and they then told his sisters. He never ever was sexual with them....he never tried to have sex with them....he was a goofy 12-year old that, never went to public school and he he let his demons get the best of him...and he was copping a feel.
I'm not making light of this or saying what he did was okay.....but, the word "molestation" can mean many things....THAT is why his parents tried to handle this themselves at first, then when he said that he, himself was worried....they seeked counseling....then, they went to the police on there own.
They didn't have to do anything...but they did. Now, the Son is probably going to have a very rough way to go.....they family will have a rough way to go.....
But, like I said earlier....they are the ones that chose to be on TV....so, this is what can happen.
Bill Clinton - "I did not have sexual relations with that woman."
Quote from: Bo D on July 17, 2015, 01:48:53 PM
Bill Clinton - "I did not have sexual relations with that woman."
The only difference is, ONE was the POTUS....the other is a tv personality....on a low rated cable show.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 02:04:20 PM
The only difference is, ONE was the POTUS....the other is a tv personality....on a low rated cable show.
Yet you vilify one, and make excuses for the other.
Quote from: Bo D on July 17, 2015, 02:13:48 PM
Yet you vilify one, and make excuses for the other.
sure why not?
BTW, it wasn't just copping a feel of their breasts and they weren't always asleep.
It was wrong and his parents tried to cover it up to save their show! I don't care whose his parents are and wrong is wrong! Like I said, if I caught our son doing this to any kid, I would be pursuing charges or encouraging parent to take charges against him and getting help for the victim!! It is wrong on so many levels.
Quote from: Bo D on July 17, 2015, 03:22:03 PM
Hypocrisy at its best! :rolleyes:
WOW! REALLY??? You obviously have no humor.....Clinton was a skank who cheated on his wife. Duggar was a 12 year old copping a feel off of his sister why she was sleeping.......ya, I guess that is the same thing isn't it.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 01:24:20 PM
What do you think this kid did? Tell me. Wait, I will tell you, he was 12 years old, and he touched his sisters and their friends boobs, on a few occasions, while they were asleep. The girls never even knew it, until he told his parents, and they then told his sisters. He never ever was sexual with them....he never tried to have sex with them....he was a goofy 12-year old that, never went to public school and he he let his demons get the best of him...and he was copping a feel.
I'm not making light of this or saying what he did was okay.....but, the word "molestation" can mean many things....THAT is why his parents tried to handle this themselves at first, then when he said that he, himself was worried....they seeked counseling....then, they went to the police on there own.
They didn't have to do anything...but they did. Now, the Son is probably going to have a very rough way to go.....they family will have a rough way to go.....
But, like I said earlier....they are the ones that chose to be on TV....so, this is what can happen.
I would suggest you look up what is considered sexual contact because what he did was that whether the girls were asleep or not! I do know had this been in Kentucky that he did this, regardless that he is now an adult, and this did as juvenile he would have been charged with a felony. Kentucky has no statute of limitations on being charged!
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 03:24:33 PM
WOW! REALLY??? You obviously have no humor.....Clinton was a skank who cheated on his wife. Duggar was a 12 year old copping a feel off of his sister why she was sleeping.......ya, I guess that is the same thing isn't it.
2003: In March of 2003, nine months after the first incidents, Jim Bob Duggar and his wife Michelle Duggar are made aware of two more incidents, according to the report. In one instance, he allegedly
molested a victim while she was sitting in his lap, according to the report.
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 03:23:59 PM
It was wrong and his parents tried to cover it up to save their show! I don't care whose his parents are and wrong is wrong! Like I said, if I caught our son doing this to any kid, I would be pursuing charges or encouraging parent to take charges against him and getting help for the victim!! It is wrong on so many levels.
THEY were the ones who let the cat out of the bag....they could have kept quite and their show would still be on.....but THEY, exposed the whole thing on National TV....told the world exactly what happened. They DID go to the police. The police realized they didn't need to file charges. The parents DID have counseling with the son AND the girls. The girls never knew what happened, so they were not effected too much by it. The boy has asked for forgiveness....expressed extreme sorrow.
He was 12 years old.
I think THIS is an example of the media making a story out of nothing..............but, like I have said several times now, the duggars put themselves in the limelight, so they gotta take the good with the bad.
Quote from: Bo D on July 17, 2015, 03:31:21 PM
2003: In March of 2003, nine months after the first incidents, Jim Bob Duggar and his wife Michelle Duggar are made aware of two more incidents, according to the report. In one instance, he allegedly molested a victim while she was sitting in his lap, according to the report.
Maybe.....all I know is what I saw on TV, with an interview with them.........so, if this kid has done more, then so be it. I am not going to lose any sleep over it.
So, tell me how does this compare to the skank Clinton, who CHEATED on his wife, while he was IN THE WHITE HOUSE? With a 20 year old kid?
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 03:33:56 PM
THEY were the ones who let the cat out of the bag....they could have kept quite and their show would still be on.....but THEY, exposed the whole thing on National TV....told the world exactly what happened. They DID go to the police. The police realized they didn't need to file charges. The parents DID have counseling with the son AND the girls. The girls never knew what happened, so they were not effected too much by it. The boy has asked for forgiveness....expressed extreme sorrow.
He was 12 years old.
I think THIS is an example of the media making a story out of nothing..............but, like I have said several times now, the duggars put themselves in the limelight, so they gotta take the good with the bad.
I don't think they wanted anyone to know, otherwise they would have done something when their son was 12 and not when adult! The counseling was not what anyone would call counseling but by someone they chose. Most people go with qualified counselors who deal in sexual abuse in victims, not a preacher who would have no idea how to deal with this unless licensed to deal with that! Yeah,in there state the statute of limitations had ran out so of course the police couldn't file charges!
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 03:41:34 PM
I don't think they wanted anyone to know, otherwise they would have done something when their son was 12 and not when adult! The counseling was not what anyone would call counseling but by someone they chose. Most people go with qualified counselors who deal in sexual abuse in victims, not a preacher who would have no idea how to deal with this unless licensed to deal with that! Yeah,in there state the statute of limitations had ran out so of course the police couldn't file charges!
So, you know that a Pastor is not qualified in dealing with such things? Of COURSE they didn't WANT everyone to know....and what parent would? At least the first time any good parent would try to deal with it on there own. Having a Pastor speak with him was probably and EXCELLENT way to go. Spiritual folks take that serious. As a Christian myself, I put a lot of stock into a wise Christian Elder. They carry a lot of great wisdom on earthy issues.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 03:37:58 PM
So, tell me how does this compare to the skank Clinton, who CHEATED on his wife, while he was IN THE WHITE HOUSE? With a 20 year old kid?
Does the magnitude of the same wrong depend on who does it?
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 03:46:57 PM
So, you know that a Pastor is not qualified in dealing with such things? Of COURSE they didn't WANT everyone to know....and what parent would? At least the first time any good parent would try to deal with it on there own. Having a Pastor speak with him was probably and EXCELLENT way to go. Spiritual folks take that serious. As a Christian myself, I put a lot of stock into a wise Christian Elder. They carry a lot of great wisdom on earthy issues.
Most pastors are not qualified to deal with sexual abuse nor licensed in that type of therapy. It takes someone with extensive degrees in social work to work with sexual abuse. By the way, any parent worth their salt would have an inkling that something was going on. I don't trust preachers, priests or whatever religious figures to deal with issues like this and most don't have the skills to handle that! As a parent, you don't have to let everyone know but you need to do what is right, step up to the plate and do what is right! They didn't and thought that the attention they would get would save their show and embassment. I am glad to see it go away. The Quiver movement is part of a cult and one they are a part of!
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 03:46:57 PM
So, you know that a Pastor is not qualified in dealing with such things? Of COURSE they didn't WANT everyone to know....and what parent would? At least the first time any good parent would try to deal with it on there own. Having a Pastor speak with him was probably and EXCELLENT way to go. Spiritual folks take that serious. As a Christian myself, I put a lot of stock into a wise Christian Elder. They carry a lot of great wisdom on earthy issues.
They didn't have a Pastor counsel him ...
Jim Bob Duggar meets with the elders of his church to discuss what action they can take to prevent further abuse, according to the police report. He says the elders agree that Josh needs treatment.
Jim Bob Duggar tells police that Josh Duggar went through a Christian counseling program from March 17 to July 17, where he "did manual labor and had counseling," according to the 2006 police report.
It's unclear whether the counseling program was with a certified counselor, and Jim Bob Duggar tells police he cannot recall the name of the facility, according to the report.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/people/2015/05/28/timeline-josh-duggar-19-kids-and-counting-tlc-sex-abuse-scandal/28066229/ (http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/people/2015/05/28/timeline-josh-duggar-19-kids-and-counting-tlc-sex-abuse-scandal/28066229/)
Quote from: Bo D on July 17, 2015, 03:53:06 PM
They didn't have a Pastor counsel him ...
Jim Bob Duggar meets with the elders of his church to discuss what action they can take to prevent further abuse, according to the police report. He says the elders agree that Josh needs treatment.
Jim Bob Duggar tells police that Josh Duggar went through a Christian counseling program from March 17 to July 17, where he "did manual labor and had counseling," according to the 2006 police report. It's unclear whether the counseling program was with a certified counselor, and Jim Bob Duggar tells police he cannot recall the name of the facility, according to the report.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/people/2015/05/28/timeline-josh-duggar-19-kids-and-counting-tlc-sex-abuse-scandal/28066229/ (http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/people/2015/05/28/timeline-josh-duggar-19-kids-and-counting-tlc-sex-abuse-scandal/28066229/)
Most Christian counselors are not certified counselors and work basically with whatever church that one belongs too or wishes to go to. I never referred people to Christian counselors because most wanted to brain wash people into believing their beliefs or faith. I referred them to licensed social workers who specialized in the field they needed help in!
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 03:57:35 PM
I never referred people to Christian counselors because most wanted to brain wash people into believing their beliefs or faith.
WOW!!!
When I was a kid, my mom didn't want me to play with some kids in the neighborhood. She said they were strange people who went to the Methodist church where they "spoke in tongues."
She was right! :biggrin:
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 03:52:15 PM
I am glad to see it go away. The Quiver movement is part of a cult and one they are a part of!
Do you have anything to back that up? Is this part of being reckless?
According to the Duggars in their book....
"Even though Wikipedia and some Internet blogs report that we are part of a QuiverFull movement, we are not. We are simply Bible-believing Christians who desire to follow God's Word and apply it to our lives"
Quote from: Bo D on July 17, 2015, 04:13:38 PM
When I was a kid, my mom didn't want me to play with some kids in the neighborhood. She said they were strange people who went to the Methodist church where they "spoke in tongues."
She was right! :biggrin:
Moms usually are... :biggrin:
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 04:14:32 PM
Do you have anything to back that up? Is this part of being reckless?
According to the Duggars in their book....
"Even though Wikipedia and some Internet blogs report that we are part of a QuiverFull movement, we are not. We are simply Bible-believing Christians who desire to follow God's Word and apply it to our lives"
You need to read about the Quiver movement and Duggar is lying. They are a huge part of it! The Quiver movement is exactly that!
Quote from: Bo D on July 17, 2015, 04:13:38 PM
When I was a kid, my mom didn't want me to play with some kids in the neighborhood. She said they were strange people who went to the Methodist church where they "spoke in tongues."
She was right! :biggrin:
Bahahaha!!
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 04:08:12 PM
WOW!!!
Wow, what? Hard to believe that Christian counselors would do that? I referred one person to a Christian counseling agency and the person referred said they attempted to brain wash them into believing and coming to their church! I quit sending them there because I felt a counselor shouldn't do that!
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 04:17:56 PM
You need to read about the Quiver movement and Duggar is lying. They are a huge part of it! The Quiver movement is exactly that!
:yes:
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 04:17:56 PM
You need to read about the Quiver movement and Duggar is lying. They are a huge part of it! The Quiver movement is exactly that!
I have....I have a friend I work with who has NEVER heard of an quiver movement....they have eight kids....they did so, because of a strong faith in God. Why is that hard for a secular person to believe?
I had five kids, I would have had more. I LOVE being a Dad. My wife LOVED being a Mother.....we stopped, because my wife's body was done. she could not spit any more out. It was also getting pretty expensive..... :razz: .
I never heard of any quiver movement until today. They DO sound a tad radical....but, if they are paying for those kids and being good parents, whose business is it?
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 04:20:41 PM
Wow, what? Hard to believe that Christian counselors would do that? I referred one person to a Christian counseling agency and the person referred said they attempted to brain wash them into believing and coming to their church! I quit sending them there because I felt a counselor shouldn't do that!
A non-Christian person would feel that way........and not ALL Christian counselors are that way. You like to sterotype a lot it seems to me.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 04:23:20 PM
I have....I have a friend I work with who has NEVER heard of an quiver movement....they have eight kids....they did so, because of a strong faith in God. Why is that hard for a secular person to believe?
I had five kids, I would have had more. I LOVE being a Dad. My wife LOVED being a Mother.....we stopped, because my wife's body was done. she could not spit any more out. It was also getting pretty expensive..... :razz: .
I never heard of any quiver movement until today. They DO sound a tad radical....but, if they are paying for those kids and being good parents, whose business is it?
http://www.tonpetitlook.com/en/2014/05/01/duggar-family-and-quiverfull-movement-why-they-are-anything-harmless
This is one article and Wikipedia even claims they are part of the movement .
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/nolongerquivering/2012/08/nlq-faq-revisited-are-jim-bob-michelle-duggar-quiverfull/
There are a lot of people who have had huge families and it not be a part of this movement but when you tend to have more than 14 or more kids and parade your lives on television, it raises the eyebrows of a lot of people.
Now you see why I have no use for them as they want to make a woman like a brood cow and the man is the ultimate head of the house hold and bread winner. Sorry that idea is so old that it needs to be thrown out with the wash.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 04:24:47 PM
A non-Christian person would feel that way........and not ALL Christian counselors are that way. You like to sterotype a lot it seems to me.
I am a Christian. I just don't believe in sending people to Christian counselors who have a tendency to brainwash people. People have a right to choose their own religious beliefs or non beliefs and sending them to a Christian counselor who would brain wash someone was wrong.
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 04:30:03 PM
I am a Christian. I just don't believe in sending people to Christian counselors who have a tendency to brainwash people. People have a right to choose their own religious beliefs or non beliefs and sending them to a Christian counselor who would brain wash someone was wrong.
I couldn't agree with you more. But not ALL Christian Counselors are nutjobs.......some actually have the BEST in mind for the person they are helping.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 04:23:20 PM
I have....I have a friend I work with who has NEVER heard of an quiver movement....they have eight kids....they did so, because of a strong faith in God. Why is that hard for a secular person to believe?
I had five kids, I would have had more. I LOVE being a Dad. My wife LOVED being a Mother.....we stopped, because my wife's body was done. she could not spit any more out. It was also getting pretty expensive..... :razz: .
I never heard of any quiver movement until today. They DO sound a tad radical....but, if they are paying for those kids and being good parents, whose business is it?
You really do need to read up on it. There is much more to it than spitting out a bunch of rug rats. It has been linked to sexual abuse and teaches total subservience of women, among other atrocities.
Quote from: Bo D on July 17, 2015, 04:13:38 PM
When I was a kid, my mom didn't want me to play with some kids in the neighborhood. She said they were strange people who went to the Methodist church where they "spoke in tongues."
She was right! :biggrin:
I do believe it's Pentacostals that speak in tongues not Methodist.
Quote from: Bo D on July 17, 2015, 04:37:03 PM
You really do need to read up on it. There is much more to it than spitting out a bunch of rug rats. It has been linked to sexual abuse and teaches total subservience of women, among other atrocities.
Exactly, Bo D. They expect their women to be subservient and to me, bow down to the man. It is ridiculous. There have been tons of articles on it and all have the Duggars linked to the movement.
Quote from: me on July 17, 2015, 04:37:56 PM
I do believe it's Pentacostals that speak in tongues not Methodist.
Are they the same ones who play with deadly snakes in the hopes that they will survive the snake bite? Lol
Quote from: me on July 17, 2015, 04:37:56 PM
I do believe it's Pentacostals that speak in tongues not Methodist.
Are you from my neighborhood? It was the Methodist church. There were no Pentecostals where I grew up. Baptists and Methodists. Only two churches there.
Of course if you know better what it was like in Abb's Valley in the 1950's ....
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 04:41:04 PM
Are they the same ones who play with deadly snakes in the hopes that they will survive the snake bite? Lol
The Methodists in Abb's Valley didn't do that. But maybe you should ask 'me' She seems to know more about the churches there.
Quote from: Bo D on July 17, 2015, 04:43:39 PM
The Methodists in Abb's Valley didn't do that. But maybe you should ask 'me' She seems to know more about the churches there.
The only churches that I have heard of that play with deadly snakes are Pentecostal or full faith! LOL, I always think dumbass, you deserve to get bit, if you play with a poisonous snake!
Quote from: Bo D on July 17, 2015, 04:37:03 PM
You really do need to read up on it. There is much more to it than spitting out a bunch of rug rats. It has been linked to sexual abuse and teaches total subservience of women, among other atrocities.
I have read just little this afternoon....yeah, seems pretty strange. But the Duggars don't have anything to suggest that. They just like having kids it seems to me. My friend at work who has eight, just LOVE kids. They too, would have had more....it has nothing to with any cult. Just leaving it to free will of God. If they have more, then they have more....if they don't then they are still happy.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 04:51:39 PM
I have read just little this afternoon....yeah, seems pretty strange. But the Duggars don't have anything to suggest that. They just like having kids it seems to me. My friend at work who has eight, just LOVE kids. They too, would have had more....it has nothing to with any cult. Just leaving it to free will of God. If they have more, then they have more....if they don't then they are still happy.
I said it was similar to a cult, that is my opinion and you need to read a lot of articles on it because too most people the Duggar's are involved and it is like a cult! By the way, when you look up Quiver movement, it is described as a cult movement.
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 04:28:23 PM
Now you see why I have no use for them as they want to make a woman like a brood cow and the man is the ultimate head of the house hold and bread winner. Sorry that idea is so old that it needs to be thrown out with the wash.
But it doesn't effect you in any way, shape or form. Why is it if somebody thinks being gay is wrong....they are horrible people...what if I said the idea of two men sleeping together should be thrown out with the wash? I don't, I can care less what two men or two women do...it doesn't effect me in any way, shape or form.
Seems hypocritical to me....
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 05:06:12 PM
But it doesn't effect you in any way, shape or form. Why is it if somebody thinks being gay is wrong....they are horrible people...what if I said the idea of two men sleeping together should be thrown out with the wash? I don't, I can care less what two men or two women do...it doesn't effect me in any way, shape or form.
Seems hypocritical to me....
We aren't talking about gay. I have never said anything about anyone being gay because it doesn't bother me. I think it is wrong for any man to treat women like they are brood cows or that a woman is subservient to a man. If a man treats a woman this way, it is abusive and wrong. Sorry, you can't seem to get that. This isn't back when men were the only bread winners because now women are also.
Here is another article about the so-called cult.
http://duggarsonmymind.blogspot.com/2010/04/jim-bob-duggar-quiverfull-cult-leader.html
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 04:54:14 PM
I said it was similar to a cult,
You said it was a cult. But, I don't care. The Duggars say they are NOT part of it. I think they would know if they are or not.
anyway..I'm outta here....see ya soon!
:)
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 05:09:07 PM
We aren't talking about gay. I have never said anything about anyone being gay because it doesn't bother me. I think it is wrong for any man to treat women like they are brood cows or that a woman is subservient to a man. If a man treats a woman this way, it is abusive and wrong. Sorry, you can't seem to get that. This isn't back when men were the only bread winners because now women are also.
Here is another article about the so-called cult.
http://duggarsonmymind.blogspot.com/2010/04/jim-bob-duggar-quiverfull-cult-leader.html
I'm sure this BLOGGER is just RIGHT on...and the Duggars are just wrong...
duh?
see ya!
:)
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 05:11:18 PM
I'm sure this BLOGGER is just RIGHT on...and the Duggars are just wrong...
duh?
see ya!
:)
There have been more than just that article calling them a cult. The Quiver movement is a cult, regardless of what the blogger says.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 05:10:03 PM
You said it was a cult. But, I don't care. The Duggars say they are NOT part of it. I think they would know if they are or not.
anyway..I'm outta here....see ya soon!
:)
I will stand by my comment that it is a cult and so will most people who have read articles about the Quiver movement being a cult. Read all the articles that are out there and not just a few. Every article out there has called them a cult, so I guess Newsweek, and others who have written on the Quiver Movement and Duggars are wrong. Nope, they aren't. So, I guess you are going to believe the Duggar's and that their son only touched the girls but not sexually!
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 04:41:04 PM
Are they the same ones who play with deadly snakes in the hopes that they will survive the snake bite? Lol
I don't think so, at least not around here.
Quote from: Bo D on July 17, 2015, 04:41:42 PM
Are you from my neighborhood? It was the Methodist church. There were no Pentecostals where I grew up. Baptists and Methodists. Only two churches there.
Of course if you know better what it was like in Abb's Valley in the 1950's ....
I don't know of any around here that do that. I do know I lived not far from a Pentecostal church when I was a kid and just the sounds coming out of there every Sunday, we were about a mile away, scared the crap out of me.
Make up your mind first you said it was a cult, then you said it was similar to a cult, now you say it is........it might be. I never said it wasnt. I just said the Duggars claim they were not part of them, they just believe in allowing Gods will on the number of kids they have.
I watched the Duggar interview and I believe they are telling the truth. As far as Newsweek, they are not the gospel, and have been caught in stretching the truth a few times, to sell a few magazines.
Look, I really don't care one way or the other about the future of the Duggars. They were compensated for the time the we're on the air and they put themselves out there for the public to attack them. But I stand by my opinion that they are good parents, who make mistakes, but the fact is they have a bunch of well behaved intelligent kids.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 08:16:08 PM
Make up your mind first you said it was a cult, then you said it was similar to a cult, now you say it is........it might be. I never said it wasnt. I just said the Duggars claim they were not part of them, they just believe in allowing Gods will on the number of kids they have.
I watched the Duggar interview and I believe they are telling the truth. As far as Newsweek, they are not the gospel, and have been caught in stretching the truth a few times, to sell a few magazines.
Look, I really don't care one way or the other about the future of the Duggars. They were compensated for the time the we're on the air and they put themselves out there for the public to attack them. But I stand by my opinion that they are good parents, who make mistakes, but the fact is they have a bunch of well behaved intelligent kids.
I also said that I stand by my comment that they are a cult. Every article out there on them has called this a cult and one they are part of! No,good parents wouldn't try to cover this up but instead, do what is right and make their kid be responsible for what happened. I don't see that they did when they tried to sweep it under the rug and hope that they got by with it! And the only way, we know that their kids are intelligent is by what was seen on television, none of us know whether they were that or not! Of course, I also feel that the kid did sexual contact whether you think that or not but it is!
Like Bo D said there is more to the Quiver Movement than popping out kids but making a woman subservient to a man is wrong. This isn't Biblical times but 2015!
Quote from: me on July 17, 2015, 08:11:56 PM
I don't think so, at least not around here.
I don't know of any around here that do that. I do know I lived not far from a Pentecostal church when I was a kid and just the sounds coming out of there every Sunday, we were about a mile away, scared the crap out of me.
I was teasing about the snakes! Yeah, growing up, I lived next door to one of those type of churches like you did! It was scary!
If you would watch the interview with an open mind I think you would not be so critical of them. As far as the quiver dudes big deal...it is what they believe. They probably suck, but they get to have that right here in the USA.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 08:44:29 PM
If you would watch the interview with an open mind I think you would not be so critical of them. As far as the quiver dudes big deal...it is what they believe. They probably suck, but they get to have that right here in the USA.
You assume I didn't see the interviews, yes I have seen their interviews and it doesn't change my opinion of them at all. By the way, I would be concerned about the Quiver movement being more than you think!
Please tell me why? You worry about a groooup of horny Christians, but ok
m with a potus giving Iran a green light to build nukes?
Okeedoke!
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 08:54:32 PM
Please tell me why? You worry about a groooup of horny Christians, but ok
m with a potus giving Iran a green light to build nukes?
Okeedoke!
Please show me where I have said I am okay about Iran getting nukes because I haven't and never have been with any president doing that!
Like I said, you think it is all about them having kids and isn't. I don't think any woman should be subservient to a man and that is what there movement is about also. Like I said, this is 2015, not Biblical times!
Here's the Duggar family statement on the cancellation.
Today, TLC announced that they will not be filming new episodes of 19 Kids and Counting.
Years ago, when we were asked to film our first one hour documentary about the logistics of raising 14 children, we felt that it was an opportunity to share with the world that children are a blessing and a gift from God.
We are so thankful for our film crew that has shown up at our house for over a decade. They have become like family to us. They have invested their time and energy into our lives and have been so loving and patient. We love and appreciate them so much!
Over the last several years people have said to us, "We love your show!" We have always responded, "It's not a show, it's our lives!" Our desire in opening our home to the world is to share Bible principles that are the answers for life's problems.
With God's grace and help Josh, our daughters and our entire family overcame a terrible situation, found healing and a way forward. We are so pleased with the wonderful adults they have all become.
It is our prayer that the painful situation our family went through many years ago can point people toward faith in God and help others who also have lived through similar dark situations to find help, hope and healing, as well.
We appreciate the love, support, prayers and kindness extended to us by many of you. You have deeply touched our hearts and encouraged us, during this time.
God's faithfulness and goodness to us, along with His abundant grace have given us strength and joy even in the most difficult days.
We have committed to Him that in all things—difficulties or success, good times or bad—we will purpose to bring Him honor by staying true to our faith and our family.
We look forward to working with TLC on this upcoming special documentary and hope that it is an encouragement to many.
We know Who holds the future and are confident that He will work all things together for good.
We love each of you and look forward to unfolding the future with peace and joy.
With Gratefulness,
Jim Bob and Michelle Duggar family
http://www.duggarfamily.com/2015/7/duggar-family-statement
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 08:54:32 PM
You worry about a groooup of horny Christians, but ok
m with a potus giving Iran a green light to build nukes?
Okeedoke!
:sm69:
:rolleyes:
Not really. I just don't understand how so many people get upset over this family but are quiet about some real issues. Just my thoughts,
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 03:33:56 PM
He was 12 years old.
No, he was 14 and 15 years old when these molestations occurred.
QuoteI think THIS is an example of the media making a story out of nothing...
This sort of thing is apparently more commonplace in your world so it's no big deal.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 03:37:58 PM
So, tell me how does this compare to the skank Clinton, who CHEATED on his wife, while he was IN THE WHITE HOUSE? With a 20 year old kid?
20 years old is, by law, an adult.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 17, 2015, 04:23:20 PM
I have....I have a friend I work with who has NEVER heard of an quiver movement....they have eight kids....they did so, because of a strong faith in God.
I had five kids, I would have had more.
Here are some other things in which your ilk has a strong faith: overpopulation, division of wealth and not being responsible parents by insuring that you don't have more children than
you can afford to pay to put through college
yourself should they want to go.
Quote from: Exterminator on July 19, 2015, 01:47:35 PM
20 years old is, by law, an adult.
Even 18 is an adult and in some states, a juvenile can be charged as an adult!
Quote from: Exterminator on July 19, 2015, 01:52:38 PM
Here are some other things in which your ilk has a strong faith: overpopulation, division of wealth and not being responsible parents by insuring that you don't have more children than you can afford to pay to put through college yourself should they want to go.
:yes:
Quote from: Exterminator on July 19, 2015, 01:44:22 PM
No, he was 14 and 15 years old when these molestations occurred.
And they weren't just "copping a feel" of the breasts, and the victims weren't always asleep as Hank has claimed either.
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 17, 2015, 11:38:07 AM
No, most normal parents would have pursued charges, yes, even if it meant on their own child and most normal parents would have gotten help for the victims. I don't consider them good parents but actually attention whores.
You got to be a wacko. :wacko: You want to ruin you're son's life forever? You're just one old crazy women without one brain in your head. Didn't any of you Kentuckians ever play doctor. Play "let's see what you got in the hay mow or tobacco barn when you were kids. :smile: I'm sure you have, old women. :yes: Cut the bull shit. :rolleyes: :razz:
Quote from: The Troll on July 19, 2015, 07:53:46 PM
You got to be a wacko. :wacko: You want to ruin you're son's life forever? You're just one old crazy women without one brain in your head. Didn't any of you Kentuckians ever play doctor. Play "let's see what you got in the hay mow or tobacco barn when you were kids. :smile: I'm sure you have, old women. :yes: Cut the bull shit. :rolleyes: :razz:
It is not bull shit! See that is what is wrong is too many parents would cover something like this up. This wasn't playing doctor but sexual molesting or abuse and if that meant taking charges against my son than I would especially if it would get him help and the victims but I know you don't understand that! You see normal parents would do that and not try to cover this up!! And no old man, most of the work that was done on our farm was done by my brothers, parents and myself, we didn't hire outside help! But you seem to think we did! You need to get your mind out of the gutter and learn that these girls were sexually abused by a family member! You do know what that is,don't you!? If not, look it up! The only one who is a wacko is you and you thinking that kids could be allowed to get by with this.. Do you even understand the ramifications that letting this go has on the victims? They would feel that they are always to blame and often leads to other issues! Try to learn about the effects that this has on abused victims before you open your mouth and make the ass out of yourself that you are good at!!
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 19, 2015, 09:26:47 PM
It is not bull shit! See that is what is wrong is too many parents would cover something like this up. This wasn't playing doctor but sexual molesting or abuse and if that meant taking charges against my son than I would especially if it would get him help and the victims but I know you don't understand that! You see normal parents would do that and not try to cover this up!! And no old man, most of the work that was done on our farm was done by my brothers, parents and myself, we didn't hire outside help! But you seem to think we did! You need to get your mind out of the gutter and learn that these girls were sexually abused by a family member! You do know what that is,don't you!? If not, look it up! The only one who is a wacko is you and you thinking that kids could be allowed to get by with this.. Do you even understand the ramifications that letting this go has on the victims? They would feel that they are always to blame and often leads to other issues! Try to learn about the effects that this has on abused victims before you open your mouth and make the ass out of yourself that you are good at!!
Get all of the parties help, yes, but to file charges and tag a 14 or 15 yr old for the rest of their lives would be wrong. I believe the parents did the right thing and whoever released the information was totally in the wrong.
Quote from: me on July 19, 2015, 09:58:33 PM
Get all of the parties help, yes, but to file charges and tag a 14 or 15 yr old for the rest of their lives would be wrong. I believe the parents did the right thing and whoever released the information was totally in the wrong.
No, the parents tried to cover this up. How are they going to get the help unless charges are filed? It is not ruining their lives but getting all parties involved help.
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 19, 2015, 10:09:30 PM
No, the parents tried to cover this up. How are they going to get the help unless charges are filed? It is not ruining their lives but getting all parties involved help.
Old woman, you don't know how the cops work. :no: Their job is to punish and get a pound of flesh from anyone they arrest. :yes: You're crazy old simple minded old woman who knows nothing but wanting a pound of flesh and a quart of blood. :devil4: :dracula:
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 19, 2015, 10:09:30 PM
No, the parents tried to cover this up. How are they going to get the help unless charges are filed? It is not ruining their lives but getting all parties involved help.
Take them to counseling and have a trained professonal help them. If charges are filed they don't get proper help and they are marked for life.
Wrong, if charges are filed, a judge can order help. I have a friend who worked in this field and she plus the judges would get the parties the help they needed. It wasn't always the cop doing the charges so again, wrong on that part also. Some people.aren't going to get the help they need unless court ordered. It would be nice if we lived in a world where one wouldn't have to do that but that isn't the case.
Quote from: The Troll on July 19, 2015, 11:09:19 PM
Old woman, you don't know how the cops work. :no: Their job is to punish and get a pound of flesh from anyone they arrest. :yes: You're crazy old simple minded old woman who knows nothing but wanting a pound of flesh and a quart of blood. :devil4: :dracula:
Wrong. It isn't always the police taking charges but the victim and no police are involved. Do you just open your mouth and throw crap out and think you are right? You have no clue how things work in other states but you sure make an ass out of yourself constantly. In some states, Kentucky being one of them, a victim or if a minor, the adult can file a report and take charges without ever involving the police. In a case where it is a juvenile doing another juvenile than the victim would take charges with a juvenile worker. A lot of times the law officers are never involved. A juvenile officer then would have to have the charges reviewed by the county attorney who is over juvenile cases to see if probable cause exists. If it does than a letter is sent out to the juvenile and parents or guardian to appear in the juvenile office. If no cause the case is dismissed. The juvenile can bring an attorney and some charges are automatically court bound, sexual charges being one of them. In court, the judge can order counseling for all parties. When the juvenile turns 18 depending on the charge, the charge can be expunged and the record wiped clean. If the juvenile went through the juvenile office, the charge depending on what it was can be diverted and the charge wiped clean in 6 months. If you think I am lying look it up, in the Kentucky Revised Statute.
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 20, 2015, 06:04:45 AM
Wrong, if charges are filed, a judge can order help. I have a friend who worked in this field and she plus the judges would get the parties the help they needed. It wasn't always the cop doing the charges so again, wrong on that part also. Some people.aren't going to get the help they need unless court ordered. It would be nice if we lived in a world where one wouldn't have to do that but that isn't the case.
A person can go to a counselor by themselves they don't need a judge to order it. By filing charges all you do is mark the child with molestation for life and put them and the other parties involved through hell in the process.
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 20, 2015, 06:07:34 AM
Wrong. It isn't always the police taking charges but the victim and no police are involved. Do you just open your mouth and throw crap out and think you are right? You have no clue how things work in other states but you sure make an ass out of yourself constantly. In some states, Kentucky being one of them, a victim or if a minor, the adult can file a report and take charges without ever involving the police. In a case where it is a juvenile doing another juvenile than the victim would take charges with a juvenile worker. A lot of times the law officers are never involved. A juvenile officer then would have to have the charges reviewed by the county attorney who is over juvenile cases to see if probable cause exists. If it does than a letter is sent out to the juvenile and parents or guardian to appear in the juvenile office. If no cause the case is dismissed. The juvenile can bring an attorney and some charges are automatically court bound, sexual charges being one of them. In court, the judge can order counseling for all parties. When the juvenile turns 18 depending on the charge, the charge can be expunged and the record wiped clean. If the juvenile went through the juvenile office, the charge depending on what it was can be diverted and the charge wiped clean in 6 months. If you think I am lying look it up, in the Kentucky Revised Statute.
Ya, just like the charges in this case were wiped clean. :rolleyes:
Quote from: me on July 20, 2015, 07:31:55 AM
A person can go to a counselor by themselves they don't need a judge to order it. By filing charges all you do is mark the child with molestation for life and put them and the other parties involved through hell in the process.
You don't seem to understand that most people aren't going to go to a counselor at times without being ordered. By the way, a juvenile when 18 in some states can have the charges expunged and not be marked for life. Getting help is not having them marked but if they go without help they may always be marked. What about the hell of someone who refuses to get the help? Then it needs to be ordered and made sure done properly! Most judges who order counseling seem to be sympathetic to all parties involved and want what is best for all involved. Seeing as I how I know the judges in my town, most want to help the perp and the victim without making it a huge circus event. It is not always hell in the process but then people who don't have friends who work in this field don't know how the process works.
Quote from: me on July 20, 2015, 07:34:02 AM
Ya, just like the charges in this case were wiped clean. :rolleyes:
They might be but seeing as it is a sexual offense, I doubt it and that he was an adult when charged. Had he been charged when he was a juvenile than the chances of him getting the charges wiped clean would have been better.
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 20, 2015, 08:12:45 AM
You don't seem to understand that most people aren't going to go to a counselor at times without being ordered. By the way, a juvenile when 18 in some states can have the charges expunged and not be marked for life. Getting help is not having them marked but if they go without help they may always be marked. What about the hell of someone who refuses to get the help? Then it needs to be ordered and made sure done properly! Most judges who order counseling seem to be sympathetic to all parties involved and want what is best for all involved. Seeing as I how I know the judges in my town, most want to help the perp and the victim without making it a huge circus event. It is not always hell in the process but then people who don't have friends who work in this field don't know how the process works. They might be but seeing as it is a sexual offense, I doubt it and that he was an adult when charged. Had he been charged when he was a juvenile than the chances of him getting the charges wiped clean would have been better.
Now read very slowly and let this sink in.
The parents should take the child to counseling rather than file filing charges and getting the courts involved. If a parent isn't going to take a child to counceling they damn sure aren't going to file charges. By filing charges against the child you could possibly make sex out to be a dirty thing but to take them to counseling, and choosing the counselor wisely, it should be presented to them as something good between two people who love each other and taught how deal with the urges which they are beginning to experience because their harmones are suddenly running wild.
Quote from: me on July 20, 2015, 11:13:01 AM
Now read very slowly and let this sink in. The parents should take the child to counseling rather than file filing charges and getting the courts involved. If a parent isn't going to take a child to counceling they damn sure aren't going to file charges. By filing charges against the child you could possibly make sex out to be a dirty thing but to take them to counseling, and choosing the counselor wisely, it should be presented to them as something good between two people who love each other and taught how deal with the urges which they are beginning to experience because their harmones are suddenly running wild.
Quote from: me on July 20, 2015, 11:13:01 AM
Now read very slowly and let this sink in. The parents should take the child to counseling rather than file filing charges and getting the courts involved. If a parent isn't going to take a child to counceling they damn sure aren't going to file charges. By filing charges against the child you could possibly make sex out to be a dirty thing but to take them to counseling, and choosing the counselor wisely, it should be presented to them as something good between two people who love each other and taught how deal with the urges which they are beginning to experience because their harmones are suddenly running wild.
Let this sink in as slowly as possible. Not all parents are going to do that!! A lot of parents will cover it up or say their kid wouldn't do something like that! Maybe you should understand if capable that just because charges are filed doesn't mean a bad thing at all for a juvenile. Did you even bother to read that when they turn 18, there is a possibility and a good one at that of having the whole case expunged. Did you even bother to read that some parents do take charges but most of the time it is the victim and not the law? Taking a kid to counseling and getting the help for them assures that sex isn't a dirty thing but that you don't do that to unwilling subjects! A judge can make sure counseling is happening and taking place!
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 20, 2015, 12:18:55 PM
Let this sink in as slowly as possible. Not all parents are going to do that!! A lot of parents will cover it up or say their kid wouldn't do something like that! Maybe you should understand if capable that just because charges are filed doesn't mean a bad thing at all for a juvenile. Did you even bother to read that when they turn 18, there is a possibility and a good one at that of having the whole case expunged. Did you even bother to read that some parents do take charges but most of the time it is the victim and not the law? Taking a kid to counseling and getting the help for them assures that sex isn't a dirty thing but that you don't do that to unwilling subjects! A judge can make sure counseling is happening and taking place!
I don't of any parent, other than you, who would file charges on their child rather than take them to counseling. A responsible parent would follow through on the counseling and make sure it is going in the right direction without the court intervening.
Quote from: me on July 20, 2015, 12:46:07 PM
I don't of any parent, other than you, who would file charges on their child rather than take them to counseling. A responsible parent would follow through on the counseling and make sure it is going in the right direction without the court intervening.
Than you don't know very many parents, some parents will take charges but a handful of them will not and won't get the help that the perp needs. Having charges done assures that all parties involved will get help. As responsible parent would take their child to counseling but more often than not, parents will deny or try to cover this up and say it didn't happen and even blame the victim and say it is their fault that this happened. By the way, I said if I caught our child doing this would I either encourage the victim to take charges if not his sister and if it was his sister than I would do what is right! You do realize that in some states that even when reported to a counselor that charges still have to be filed if the victim is a minor. Did I ever say I wouldn't take the child to counseling? No, you just assumed I wouldn't! By the way,you get a 16-17 yar old who refuses to do what a parent says and maybe they aren't left with any alternatives but to file charges and let the court order counseling! The friend of mine who works for the juvenile system told me that parents even take outnof controls on their kids. I thought how ridiculous that a parent can't control their own kid!
By the way, if a victim files charges there isn't anything a parent can do about it but either do what the juvenile courts say or the juvenile worker decides as a diversion agreement!
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 20, 2015, 06:07:34 AM
Wrong. It isn't always the police taking charges but the victim and no police are involved. Do you just open your mouth and throw crap out and think you are right? You have no clue how things work in other states but you sure make an ass out of yourself constantly. In some states, Kentucky being one of them, a victim or if a minor, the adult can file a report and take charges without ever involving the police. In a case where it is a juvenile doing another juvenile than the victim would take charges with a juvenile worker. A lot of times the law officers are never involved. A juvenile officer then would have to have the charges reviewed by the county attorney who is over juvenile cases to see if probable cause exists. If it does than a letter is sent out to the juvenile and parents or guardian to appear in the juvenile office. If no cause the case is dismissed. The juvenile can bring an attorney and some charges are automatically court bound, sexual charges being one of them. In court, the judge can order counseling for all parties. When the juvenile turns 18 depending on the charge, the charge can be expunged and the record wiped clean. If the juvenile went through the juvenile office, the charge depending on what it was can be diverted and the charge wiped clean in 6 months. If you think I am lying look it up, in the Kentucky Revised Statute.
Old woman, I can see why you would turn one of your boys into the criminal system. :wacko: You didn't give birth to them and you never bonded like a real mother does. Real bonded mothers would never give up their boys for something that can be solved on their own. I never gave birth to my son, but I would never give him up to some half ass judge and the criminal system. You have to be out of your mind and simply just crazy. :rant:
If my son was a terrorist, a murderer, a drug dealer I would turn him in a minute. :yes: But to turn him for trying to find out what a girl's ***** looks like or what her breast looks and feels like, no way. I think all young boys and young girl experiment in trying to find out what the other sex looks like. :yes: Old woman, you're just plain crazy, head banging crazy. :wall:
Quote from: The Troll on July 20, 2015, 02:09:22 PM
Old woman, I can see why you would turn one of your boys into the criminal system. :wacko: You didn't give birth to them and you never bonded like a real mother does. Real bonded mothers would never give up their boys for something that can be solved on their own. I never gave birth to my son, but I would never give him up to some half ass judge and the criminal system. You have to be out of your mind and simply just crazy. :rant:
If my son was a terrorist, a murderer, a drug dealer I would turn him in a minute. :yes: But to turn him for trying to find out what a girl's ***** looks like or what her breast looks and feels like, no way. I think all young boys and young girl experiment in trying to find out what the other sex looks like. :yes: Old woman, you're just plain crazy, head banging crazy. :wall;
You are way out of line with your comment about bonding but what can I expect from someone like you! You probably think its the girl or even in some cases the boy's fault that they sexually abuse soemone who has not gave them permission to do so! It is like a woman saying no, no means no and someone has to protect the ones not capable of protecting themselves! I am sure you probably think it is okay to abuse a man or a woman! You are a sick man! You obviously didn't even bother to read what Kentucky does with juveniles when they are charged with anything and just assume that all of them go in front of a judge! Once again, you are making the normal ass out of yourself! Why don't you try reading and learning instead of being the know it all nothing!
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 20, 2015, 02:34:25 PM
You are way out of line with your comment about bonding but what can I expect from someone like you! You probably think its the girl or even in some cases the boy's fault that they sexually abuse soemone who has not gave them permission to do so! It is like a woman saying no, no means no and someone has to protect the ones not capable of protecting themselves! I am sure you probably think it is okay to abuse a man or a woman! You are a sick man! You obviously didn't even bother to read what Kentucky does with juveniles when they are charged with anything and just assume that all of them go in front of a judge! Once again, you are making the normal ass out of yourself! Why don't you try reading and learning instead of being the know it all nothing!
Why should I read anything about Kentucky. :haha: After what you people voted in to the congress of the United States of America. You an old jokers. :jester:
Quote from: The Troll on July 20, 2015, 02:41:06 PM
Why should I read anything about Kentucky. :haha: After what you people voted in to the congress of the United States of America. You an old jokers. :jester:
Because you seem to think that the laws are screwed up. I also bet Indiana has similar laws regarding juveniles. You do realize that some counselors are bound by law to report sexual abuse to the authorities. By the way, I didn't vote for those in Congress. I don't vote for those who want to be career politicians! But that's okay, you just assume that I did and we all know what assume means. You are good at making an ass out of yourself!
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 20, 2015, 02:43:08 PM
Because you seem to think that the laws are screwed up. I also bet Indiana has similar laws regarding juveniles. You do realize that some counselors are bound by law to report sexual abuse to the authorities. By the way, I didn't vote for those in Congress. I don't vote for those who want to be career politicians! But that's okay, you just assume that I did and we all know what assume means. You are good at making an ass out of yourself!
Thank you for reaffirming that I am an ass. The feeling I get from being an ass to you is wonderful.
But I must say we have one of the most fucked up criminal justice system in the world. When a person can be sent to prison for life for smoking pot. Sent to prison for life for none violent crimes. :rant: We have more people in jail than any country in the world, including China. :mad: :mad: Costing the taxpayers $30,000 to $40,000 a year to keep each one of them there. Free food, free bed, free medical and this is what you call a fair and true justice.
Over 18 men were released from death row in Illinois because of faulty criminal justice system. The men were found innocent, because of fucked up cops, lawyers, prosecutors and judges and most of all fucked up juries. Give me a break Old and Ugly Woman. :mad: :mad:
Quote from: The Troll on July 20, 2015, 03:09:37 PM
Thank you for reaffirming that I am an ass. The feeling I get from being an ass to you is wonderful.
But I must say we have one of the most fucked up criminal justice system in the world. When a person can be sent to prison for life for smoking pot. Sent to prison for life for none violent crimes. :rant: We have more people in jail than any country in the world, including China. :mad: :mad: Costing the taxpayers $30,000 to $40,000 a year to keep each one of them there. Free food, free bed, free medical and this is what you call a fair and true justice.
Over 18 men were released from death row in Illinois because of faulty criminal justice system. The men were found innocent, because of fucked up cops, lawyers, prosecutors and judges and most of all fucked up juries. Give me a break Old and Ugly Woman. :mad: :mad:
Did I say that I thought the laws were fair? No, I didn't! But at least we live in a free country basically which is more than other countries and I am betting in those other countries, they wouldn't even release those who are innocent!
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 20, 2015, 03:13:04 PM
Did I say that I thought the laws were fair? No, I didn't! But at least we live in a free country basically which is more than other countries and I am betting in those other countries, they wouldn't even release those who are innocent!
Are you saying that England, France, Germany, Sweden, Denmark, Japan, Finland, Spain and many more countries don't release their prisoners. :rolleyes: :wink:
Quote from: The Troll on July 20, 2015, 07:33:47 PM
Are you saying that England, France, Germany, Sweden, Denmark, Japan, Finland, Spain and many more countries don't release their prisoners. :rolleyes: :wink:
No, I imagine that some of those countries may not release if a person is innocent. You really need to learn how other countries are with prisoners! Not all countries will even believe DNA and facts that some people are innocent. I know that some countries such as Russia and those around Russia tend to not believe people who are innocent.
Quote from: The Troll on July 20, 2015, 02:09:22 PM
If my son was a terrorist, a murderer, a drug dealer I would turn him in a minute. :yes: But to turn him for trying to find out what a girl's ***** looks like or what her breast looks and feels like, no way. I think all young boys and young girl experiment in trying to find out what the other sex looks like. :yes: Old woman, you're just plain crazy, head banging crazy. :wall:
Are you fucking serious? He's not trying to find out what a girl's ***** looks like or what her breasts look and feel like. It's about power over the girl and sexually abusing her. Experimenting is consensual. Abuse is not. There doesn't need to be sex in order for it to be abuse. The Duggar girls made light a very serious situation by excusing his behavior and saying that all he did was touch them over their clothes. It doesn't matter, it's still abuse, not experimentation.
Quote from: AbbyTC on July 20, 2015, 11:54:05 PM
Are you fucking serious? He's not trying to find out what a girl's ***** looks like or what her breasts look and feel like. It's about power over the girl and sexually abusing her. Experimenting is consensual. Abuse is not. There doesn't need to be sex in order for it to be abuse. The Duggar girls made light a very serious situation by excusing his behavior and saying that all he did was touch them over their clothes. It doesn't matter, it's still abuse, not experimentation.
How in hell do you know what he was doing, Cowgirl. :cowboy: All you know is what you heard on the news media. :haha: You weren't there and you sure don't know anything. :lurker: :blah: :blah:
Quote from: The Troll on July 21, 2015, 06:09:25 PM
How in hell do you know what he was doing, Cowgirl. :cowboy: All you know is what you heard on the news media. :haha: You weren't there and you sure don't know anything. :lurker: :blah: :blah:
Were you there? Then how do you know he was experimenting? He was 14 and turned 15 when he molested four of his sisters; that's not experimenting, that's abuse. Josh said he had "acted inexcusably for which I am extremely sorry and deeply regret. I hurt others, including my family and close friends." He would not say that if all that happened was consensual.
Quote from: AbbyTC on July 21, 2015, 06:53:03 PM
Were you there? Then how do you know he was experimenting? He was 14 and turned 15 when he molested four of his sisters; that's not experimenting, that's abuse. Josh said he had "acted inexcusably for which I am extremely sorry and deeply regret. I hurt others, including my family and close friends." He would not say that if all that happened was consensual.
They must not have minded. :yes: If I had touched my sister like that, the rafters of the house would ring, MOM, MOM, MOMMY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Troll IS TOUCHING ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And Troll would have got his ass and body beat. No cops would be called and I just might have went to the hospital. :yes: :biggrin:
Quote from: The Troll on July 21, 2015, 09:04:21 PM
They must not have minded.
Where the hell is your brain? You really think those girls, let alone anyone else who has been sexually abused didn't mind it happening? They have been touched without their permission, put into a situation they never asked to be in. This will stay with them for the rest of their lives.
Quote from: AbbyTC on July 21, 2015, 09:32:46 PM
Where the hell is your brain? You really think those girls, let alone anyone else who has been sexually abused didn't mind it happening? They have been touched without their permission, put into a situation they never asked to be in. This will stay with them for the rest of their lives.
True words Abby. :yes:
According to the Duggar girls, they were asleep and never knew anything happened.
Quote from: AbbyTC on July 21, 2015, 09:32:46 PM
Where the hell is your brain? You really think those girls, let alone anyone else who has been sexually abused didn't mind it happening? They have been touched without their permission, put into a situation they never asked to be in. This will stay with them for the rest of their lives.
Agreed!!!
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 21, 2015, 09:48:35 PM
According to the Duggar girls, they were asleep and never knew anything happened.
Asleep, awake it doesn't matter. It was abuse!
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 21, 2015, 09:48:35 PM
According to the Duggar girls, they were asleep and never knew anything happened.
I think it's been pointed out before that's not true. He molested one girl while she was sitting on his lap, or did you miss Bo D's posts along those lines?
Would you excuse this behavior if someone molested your daughter while she was asleep? I think not.
Quote from: Bo D on July 17, 2015, 03:31:21 PM
2003: In March of 2003, nine months after the first incidents, Jim Bob Duggar and his wife Michelle Duggar are made aware of two more incidents, according to the report. In one instance, he allegedly molested a victim while she was sitting in his lap, according to the report.
Here is Bo's comment, don't think anyone was asleep but whether awake or asleep, it was abuse!
I am just going by the interview I watched with the family. The girls said they didn't know anything about it until they were told about it.
No, I am not saying it is okay. Based on everything I have read and heard, they dealt with this, true sorrow has been expressed by the kid, the parents were devastated and they had the boy leave the home until they felt safe for him to return. The girls are ready to move on.
It is what it is..... There is no need to make more of it than what it is. People love to hate this family, and look for every opportunity to bash them when they can.
I have made my opinion clear, I think they put themselves in the limelight, so they gotta deal with it.
I read this entire thread and came away with mixed feelings. First of all, I think I may be living in an alternate universe, because I had never heard of the Duggers until I read this thread. As HH wrote, what kind of parents would put their children in the limelight like that?
As for the boy, yes, according to what I've read here, he didn't get caught, he confessed to touching, and that says something (favorable) about him.
So, just for the heck of it, let me say that, as one who grew up with 4 sisters, no brothers, and a lot of boy and girl cousins living nearby, that girls, no matter what their age, are not necessarily little angels. When my little boy was about 4, he was bullied by a girl who was about 2 years older. I just happened to look outside and saw him waist deep in a pond, while the girl stood there laughing at him. When I asked him why he did it, he said she told him to. It never occurred to me that she might have also abused him sexually. I say that because, several years ago, at a class reunion, I met up with a man, a marine colonel I went to high school with, and we discovered we lived and worked fairly close together. We talked and talked, and some of it was about school days. That was when he told me the following story:
When he was a little boy three girls about his age or a little older took him into the woods, took off their panties, and told him to "do it" to them. He said he didn't understand what they were talking about. I was so surprised, because I knew the girls (they were at the reunion) that I forgot to ask if he told anybody.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 21, 2015, 09:48:35 PM
According to the Duggar girls, they were asleep and never knew anything happened.
Here we go again ... repeat a lie until it becomes the truth. :rolleyes:
Quote from: Bo D on July 22, 2015, 08:55:39 AM
Here we go again ... repeat a lie until it becomes the truth. :rolleyes:
That is what they said! I watched the interview.....THAT IS WHAT THE GIRLS SAID! How is that a lie? Just because YOU READ something....I heard it from the sisters MOUTHS on National TV!
DAMN!
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 09:22:12 AM
That is what they said! I watched the interview.....THAT IS WHAT THE GIRLS SAID! How is that a lie? Just because YOU READ something....I heard it from the sisters MOUTHS on National TV!
DAMN!
Does it matter whose lie it was?
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 09:22:12 AM
That is what they said! I watched the interview.....THAT IS WHAT THE GIRLS SAID! How is that a lie? Just because YOU READ something....I heard it from the sisters MOUTHS on National TV!
DAMN!
Regardless whether they were awake or asleep, it was abuse!
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 22, 2015, 09:34:26 AM
Regardless whether they were awake or asleep, it was abuse!
I think abuse is overplayed here....yes it was wrong, but in this case, copping a feel is NOT abuse...a kid should NOT go to jail because of this....he may need his ass whipped, but ruining a kids life over this is just as wrong. He didn't sexually molest them.....he touched them. I don't know why this is even an issue...other than the fact they are Christian, and people LOVE IT when a Christian screws up.
The definition of abuse is .....
treat (a person or an animal) with cruelty or violence, especially regularly or repeatedly.....
I don't this he was being violent or cruel...he was being slightly perverted, but he is also a goofy teenager, who has hormones popping. He KNEW he was doing wrong and he told his parents about it. They made sure he was not alone with them....they even made him leave the home for a short while.
For the life of me, I think this is the most over-talked about story....
I am tapping out on this one....I have said what I could say....it don't mean squat in the grand scheme of things. :yes:
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 09:59:54 AM
I think abuse is overplayed here....yes it was wrong, but in this case, copping a feel is NOT abuse...a kid should NOT go to jail because of this....he may need his ass whipped, but ruining a kids life over this is just as wrong. He didn't sexually molest them.....he touched them. I don't know why this is even an issue...other than the fact they are Christian, and people LOVE IT when a Christian screws up.
The definition of abuse is .....treat (a person or an animal) with cruelty or violence, especially regularly or repeatedly.....
I don't this he was being violent or cruel...he was being slightly perverted, but he is also a goofy teenager, who has hormones popping. He KNEW he was doing wrong and he told his parents about it. They made sure he was not alone with them....they even made him leave the home for a short while.
For the life of me, I think this is the most over-talked about story....
I am tapping out on this one....I have said what I could say....it don't mean squat in the grand scheme of things. :yes:
It was abuse. Power over someone who can not or is afraid to say no is abuse. It wasn't copping a feel but power over victims who are too scared to say anything!
Abuse can be physical, verbal, mental or even emotional!
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 09:59:54 AM
...copping a feel is NOT abuse... He didn't sexually molest them.....he touched them.
Are you people for real?
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 22, 2015, 10:17:34 AM
It was abuse. Power over someone who can not or is afraid to say no is abuse. It wasn't copping a feel but power over victims who are too scared to say anything!
Abuse can be physical, verbal, mental or even emotional!
THEY WERE ASLEEP! If they were awake and they told him NO, then YES, that is abuse.....
We are NOT TALKING about an adult here. WE are talking about a KID. A kid who made a bad choice. He is NOT a sexual predator...hopefully he learned a lesson. He went to the police station, the police scolded him. He was made to leave the home. He is NOW being publicly shamed....all for being a curious kid.
I would be everything if this show wasn't about a Christian family...it would have NEVER made the news.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 10:46:27 AM
THEY WERE ASLEEP!
Here we go yet again ... repeat a lie until it becomes the truth. :rolleyes:
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 10:46:27 AM
THEY WERE ASLEEP! If they were awake and they told him NO, then YES, that is abuse.....
We are NOT TALKING about an adult here. WE are talking about a KID. A kid who made a bad choice. He is NOT a sexual predator...hopefully he learned a lesson. He went to the police station, the police scolded him. He was made to leave the home. He is NOW being publicly shamed....all for being a curious kid.
I would be everything if this show wasn't about a Christian family...it would have NEVER made the news.
Nope, they weren't asleep all the time but what difference does it make because it would still be abuse. Awake or asleep, it is abuse.. You seem to think if they are awake it wouldn't have been abuse. Abuse happens to those awake and asleep.
Quote from: Bo D on July 22, 2015, 11:18:05 AM
Here we go yet again ... repeat a lie until it becomes the truth. :rolleyes:
"He said he was just curious about girls and he had gone in and just basically touched them over their clothes while they were sleeping; they didn't even know he had done it," (http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/acts-of-faith/wp/2015/06/03/what-to-expect-from-the-fox-news-interview-with-josh-duggars-parents/)
From his sisters Jill and Jessa: (http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/acts-of-faith/wp/2015/06/04/josh-duggars-sister-comes-to-his-defense-following-molestation-reports/)
"Well, I think in the case of what Josh did, it was very wrong. I'm not going to justify anything that he did or say it was ok, not permissible, but I do want to speak up in his defense against people who are calling him a child molester or a pedophile or a rapist, some people are saying. I'm like that is so overboard and a lie really, I mean people get mad at me for saying that but I can say this because I was one of the victims. So I can speak out and I can say this and set the record straight here. Like in Josh's case, he was a boy, a young boy in puberty and a little too curious about girls. And that got him into some trouble. And he made some bad choices, but really the extent of it was mild, inappropriate touching, on fully clothed victims, most of it while girls were sleeping"
From his sister Jill:
"We didn't even know about it until he went and confessed it to my parents."......"It wasn't like we were keeping a secret afraid or something. We didn't know until Josh explained to my parents what his thought process was, what everything was..."
"And then, you know, my parents explained to us what happened and then Josh came and asked each of us, individually I know, he asked me to forgive him," she said. "And I had to make that choice to forgive him, you know. And it wasn't something that somebody forced like, 'Oh you need to do this.' It's like, 'You have to make that decision for yourself.'"
"My dad explained to us, 'You know there's a difference between forgiveness and trust. That's not the same thing.' You know, you forgive someone and then you have boundaries. Forgiveness with boundaries. And so trust comes later. You know Josh destroyed that trust at the beginning. And so he had to rebuild that. And so I think when he came back, that was...the point of rebuilding."
The sisters also explained what
"safeguards" were put in place in their home, including
"locks on doors, you know, everybody's in bed. Girls in the girl's room. Boys in the boy's room,"
Tell me Bo, where am I lying? :confused:
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 10:46:27 AM
THEY WERE ASLEEP! If they were awake and they told him NO, then YES, that is abuse.....
So, I guess Bill Cosby didn't abuse any women either; huh?
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 10:46:27 AM
We are NOT TALKING about an adult here. WE are talking about a KID. A kid who made a bad choice.
But Trayvon Martin was a man; right?
I'm sure nobody coached the girls on what to say before they were interviewed. :rolleyes:
Quote from: Exterminator on July 22, 2015, 12:19:16 PM
So, I guess Bill Cosby didn't abuse any women either; huh?
There is a slight difference between being an adult and druging someone and childhood curiosity. This is a far cry from sexual abuse and by no means should anythig be pursued at this point against this boy. If that is the case then most boys of that age should be charged with sexual abuse because they are all curious as well as some, well now days, most girls.
Quote from: Exterminator on July 22, 2015, 12:28:16 PM
But Trayvon Martin was a man; right?
Why bring that into it? He was 17 not 15.
Quote from: Exterminator on July 22, 2015, 12:19:16 PM
So, I guess Bill Cosby didn't abuse any women either; huh?
How are you comparing THIS to Bill Cosby? Cosby (a grown man) has had 37 women step up and make some serious accusations..........Josh Duggar ( a 13-ear old) had his two sisters TELL exactly what happened.
Cosby, drugged and sexually assaulted several women.........Josh, copped a feel, through the clothing of his sister, WHILE she was a sleep.
Are YOU for real? are you that ignorant by trying to compare these two cases?
REALLY??
I know for a fact there HAS got to be somebody else on this forum who see's this claim as outrageous, but more than likely you will stick to gather and be silent...
Quote from: AbbyTC on July 21, 2015, 09:32:46 PM
Where the hell is your brain? You really think those girls, let alone anyone else who has been sexually abused didn't mind it happening? They have been touched without their permission, put into a situation they never asked to be in. This will stay with them for the rest of their lives.
Oh, Oh, Oh, you poor fragile women. You'll never get over having your breast touched or your butt patted. Woooooooooooooo is me. :cry: :cry: :cry: It is amazing how many women and girls will screw some worthless man and get pregnant. A man who you thought was so cool, little bad and good looking. But after they have these bastard children. They want a good hard working man to take care of them and their bastard kids. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: You women are so helpless, hopeless, fragile, I don't know how you have survived so long. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
Quote from: Exterminator on July 22, 2015, 12:29:27 PM
I'm sure nobody coached the girls on what to say before they were interviewed. :rolleyes:
Can you prove it that they were? You just hate Christians so you are a bigot. Just live up to it! Claim it! You are jut intolerant of those who have a differing opinion. You have NO CLUE that they were "coached" you just don't like them, so you are attacking them. It is THAT simple... :rolleyes:
Quote from: Exterminator on July 22, 2015, 12:28:16 PM
But Trayvon Martin was a man; right?
WOW! YOU are really struggling here....give it up, BIGOT.
Quote from: me on July 22, 2015, 12:31:13 PM
There is a slight difference between being an adult and druging someone and childhood curiosity. This is a far cry from sexual abuse and by no means should anythig be pursued at this point against this boy. If that is the case then most boys of that age should be charged with sexual abuse because they are all curious as well as some, well now days, most girls.
I was a teenage boy once and am sure I was curious. I didn't molest anyone.
Quote from: me on July 22, 2015, 12:34:32 PM
Why bring that into it?
Isn't it obvious?
QuoteHe was 17 not 15.
What's the magic cut-off age?
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 12:35:10 PM
How are you comparing THIS to Bill Cosby? Cosby (a grown man) has had 37 women step up and make some serious accusations..........Josh Duggar ( a 13-ear old) had his two sisters TELL exactly what happened.
Cosby, drugged and sexually assaulted several women.........Josh, copped a feel, through the clothing of his sister, WHILE she was a sleep.
Your own words indicate it isn't abuse if the person was asleep:
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 10:46:27 AM
THEY WERE ASLEEP! If they were awake and they told him NO, then YES, that is abuse.....
Why do you keep trying to minimize his culpability by lying about his age?
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 12:38:44 PM
Can you prove it that they were? You just hate Christians so you are a bigot. Just live up to it! Claim it! You are jut intolerant of those who have a differing opinion. You have NO CLUE that they were "coached" you just don't like them, so you are attacking them. It is THAT simple... :rolleyes:
I don't hate Christians; I hate hypocrites. Are you honestly so naive as to believe their family simply let them walk into an interview with no preparation whatsoever?
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 12:39:25 PM
WOW! YOU are really struggling here....give it up, BIGOT.
Love how the white trash here are spinning and twisting trying to defend a serial child molester.
Quote from: Exterminator on July 22, 2015, 01:08:09 PM
I don't hate Christians; I hate hypocrites. Are you honestly so naive as to believe their family simply let them walk into an interview with no preparation whatsoever?
Do you mean "coached" and in telling them what they must say? You have no proof. Zero. They are now adults themselves, both are in their 20's....so, I don't think they HAVE to be coached.
I emphasize the sleeping part, because it IS a HUGE difference. If he went up to the girls while they were awake, they could have fought back and could have been more traumatized over it and THEN it would have been abuse. As it is, they DIDN'T even know that anything had happened. They were not frightened or traumatized.
Don't get me wrong, what he did was wrong...and I have stated that a thousand times....I just don't think he needed to be arrested for it....or that he should have his life ruined over it....but, I also stated that his mom and dad made the decision to go on TV....so, they are open targets...as this has obviously demonstrated.
Quote from: Exterminator on July 22, 2015, 01:13:09 PM
Love how the white trash here are spinning and twisting trying to defend a serial child molester.
A serial child molester????? WOW!
Please tell me there is someone else out there in the zone, who is buying this sh!t.
Quote from: Exterminator on July 22, 2015, 01:08:09 PM
I don't hate Christians; I hate hypocrites.
How are the Duggars being hypocrites?
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 01:23:28 PM
How are the Duggars being hypocrites?
In the simplest of terms, hypocrisy is "do as I say, not as I do."
Quote from: Locutus on July 22, 2015, 01:35:53 PM
In the simplest of terms, hypocrisy is "do as I say, not as I do."
Example?
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 01:18:36 PM
A serial child molester????? WOW!
Multiple offenses over a span of time and multiple victims...it really isn't difficult to understand.
Quote from: Locutus on July 22, 2015, 01:35:53 PM
In the simplest of terms, hypocrisy is "do as I say, not as I do."
You aren't seriously expecting
him to be able to grasp this; are you?
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 11:57:47 AM
Tell me Bo, where am I lying? :confused:
I already did and you ignored it ... back on page two of this thread ...
Quote from: Bo D on July 17, 2015, 03:31:21 PM
2003: In March of 2003, nine months after the first incidents, Jim Bob Duggar and his wife Michelle Duggar are made aware of two more incidents, according to the report. In one instance, he allegedly molested a victim while she was sitting in his lap, according to the report.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/people/2015/05/28/timeline-josh-duggar-19-kids-and-counting-tlc-sex-abuse-scandal/28066229/ (http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/people/2015/05/28/timeline-josh-duggar-19-kids-and-counting-tlc-sex-abuse-scandal/28066229/)
Also from the same report ... "Around the same time, the person (name redacted) put his hand beneath a victim's dress in the family's laundry room, Michelle and Jim Bob Duggar
tell the police."
Quote from: Exterminator on July 22, 2015, 01:13:09 PM
Love how the white trash here are spinning and twisting trying to defend a serial child molester.
White trash????? What gives you reason to start name calling here? Can't you have a simple discussion without resorting to school yard crap? I'm beginning to get the feeling you would be perfectly ok with this if this family were athiest. You are a biggoted condescending jerk.
Quote from: me on July 22, 2015, 01:54:47 PM
White trash????? What gives you reason to start name calling here? Can't you have a simple discussion without resorting to school yard crap? I'm beginning to get the feeling you would be perfectly ok with this if this family were athiest.
Yes, anyone who doesn't recognize what this young man was doing is child molesting is definitely white trash and I don't give two shits about his religion.
QuoteYou are a biggoted condescending jerk.
How about you go fuck yourself...or maybe a family member since the incestuous nature of his crimes don't seem to phase you either. Seriously, WTF?
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 01:40:43 PM
Example?
From the article Bo D posted:
May 2002: Jim Bob Duggar loses a primary bid for the Republican Senate seat to Senator Tim Hutchinson in Arkansas. Duggar ran on a platform that "rape and incest represent heinous crimes and as such should be treated as capital crimes."
Wonder if ole' Jim Bob would mete out such punishment to his own son. I think the answer is crystal clear. :rolleyes:
Quote from: Exterminator on July 22, 2015, 01:42:07 PM
You aren't seriously expecting him to be able to grasp this; are you?
No; but I keep hoping that, just once, he may get it. :wall:
Quote from: Bo D on July 22, 2015, 01:43:55 PM
I already did and you ignored it ... back on page two of this thread ...
Also from the same report ... "Around the same time, the person (name redacted) put his hand beneath a victim's dress in the family's laundry room, Michelle and Jim Bob Duggar tell the police."
I bet she was asleep in the laundry room. Hahahahaha
Quote from: Locutus on July 22, 2015, 02:07:30 PM
From the article Bo D posted:
May 2002: Jim Bob Duggar loses a primary bid for the Republican Senate seat to Senator Tim Hutchinson in Arkansas. Duggar ran on a platform that "rape and incest represent heinous crimes and as such should be treated as capital crimes."
I'm sure he meant adults and that I would agree with as far as rape but, although I feel it's wrong, incest between two consenting adults is a choice not a crime.
Quote from: Locutus on July 22, 2015, 02:08:12 PM
Wonder if ole' Jim Bob would mete out such punishment to his own son. I think the answer is crystal clear. :rolleyes:
He didn't RAPE no one....he didn't have incest with anyone. If you seriously compare this to that, then there is no sense in arguing about it. If his son was 18 years old and done this, I would say he would not have protected him.
The bottom line for me is...I don't care. I have wasted WAY too much time on this....the family is getting trounced on, and they perhaps deserve it. I say it has MORE to do with jumping on a Christian family than it has to do with anything else.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 02:28:56 PM
He didn't RAPE no one....he didn't have incest with anyone. If you seriously compare this to that, then there is no sense in arguing about it. If his son was 18 years old and done this, I would say he would not have protected him.
The bottom line for me is...I don't care. I have wasted WAY too much time on this....the family is getting trounced on, and they perhaps deserve it. I say it has MORE to do with jumping on a Christian family than it has to do with anything else.
Nope, it would be the same whether they are Christian, non Christian, or druids, they put their lives in the spotlight and this is what happens. I don't give a tinker's damn what religion they are or aren't!
Quote from: Purplelady1040 on July 22, 2015, 02:33:37 PM
Nope, it would be the same whether they are Christian, non Christian, or druids, they put their lives in the spotlight and this is what happens. I don't give a tinker's damn what religion they are or aren't!
That is the way I feel about this POTUS, I don't care what color he is, I don't like his leadership skills (or lack of)....but, that doesn't stop several on here from calling me a racist.
There are those on here who love to call out hypocrisy but fail miserably at realizing THEY are just as guilty.....
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 03:02:29 PM
That is the way I feel about this POTUS, I don't care what color he is, I don't like his leadership skills (or lack of)....but, that doesn't stop several on here from calling me a racist.
You are a racist. Nice try at changing the subject, btw.
Quote from: Exterminator on July 22, 2015, 03:07:28 PM
You are a racist. Nice try at changing the subject, btw.
and you are a Bigot! :yes:
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 03:19:03 PM
and you are a Bigot! :yes:
Having little tolerance for stupidity does not make one a bigot.
I'm not the one trying to give the white serial molester a pass because he was just a kid while supporting the killing of a black "thug" as you would refer to him who was also not yet legally an adult.
Quote from: Exterminator on July 22, 2015, 03:45:45 PM
Having little tolerance for stupidity does not make one a bigot.
I'm not the one trying to give the white serial molester a pass because he was just a kid while supporting the killing of a black "thug" as you would refer to him who was also not yet legally an adult.
Man, you are one screwed up dude! And the big reason as to why our Country is going through the rough times....One kid touched a boob through clothing.....the other kid defaced school property, smoked pot, was a school yard bully who had been recorded for at least three fights....
If the Duggar kid is proven to be a Child Molester, I would never even try to defend him. Yet, Trayvon has been proven to be guilty of being a thug...and YOU defend him. You are just a bigot....period.
Quote from: The Troll on July 22, 2015, 12:36:37 PM
Oh, Oh, Oh, you poor fragile women. You'll never get over having your breast touched or your butt patted. Woooooooooooooo is me. :cry: :cry: :cry: It is amazing how many women and girls will screw some worthless man and get pregnant. A man who you thought was so cool, little bad and good looking. But after they have these bastard children. They want a good hard working man to take care of them and their bastard kids. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: You women are so helpless, hopeless, fragile, I don't know how you have survived so long. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
Here it is again AbbyTC. :biggrin:
A question and a few points: (followed by a comment)
According to the law in the state in which all of this took place, what is the age of consent?
According to the law, any type of physical, sexual in nature, contact with another human being (regardless of sex) is illegal when one or more of the individuals involved are under the age of consent. . . Whether they are related or not.
In some states, contact of a sexual nature between two consenting adults that are biologically related is indeed illegal as well.
Doesn't matter if the area(s) being "touched or otherwise placed into contact" are clothed or bare; to any degree.
Seems to me that a number of people around here that continuously cry for "personal responsibility" are indeed displaying a high degree of hypocrisy in this incident.
Quote from: The Troll on July 22, 2015, 04:23:41 PM
Here it is again AbbyTC. :biggrin:
You picked an apt name - Troll.
Quote from: Bo D on July 22, 2015, 04:44:31 PM
You picked an apt name - Troll.
Other appropriate names also come to mind. Ass, being one.
Quote from: Locutus on July 22, 2015, 04:52:44 PM
Other appropriate names also come to mind. Ass, being one.
I think you're being kind to Troll. ;)
Quote from: Locutus on July 22, 2015, 04:52:44 PM
Other appropriate names also come to mind. Ass, being one.
:yes:
Quote from: Locutus on July 21, 2015, 09:51:02 PM
Would you excuse this behavior if someone molested your daughter while she was asleep?
^^
HH, you must have missed that one. :wink:
Blow it off like the Duggars did, or would it be a bigger deal for you? You have sons, and daughters. What would you do?
Quote from: Locutus on July 22, 2015, 10:28:25 PM
^^
HH, you must have missed that one. :wink:
Blow it off like the Duggars did, or would it be a bigger deal for you? You have sons, and daughters. What would you do?
I would have done exactly what the Duggar did.
If all that happened was a copped feel....I would forgive, but not trust. If they were sexually attacked, I would kick their ass. Not sure what you expect me to say.
Quote from: Bo D on July 22, 2015, 04:44:31 PM
You picked an apt name - Troll.
Why thank you Bo Boo, There is some many phonies on the Zone, I just can't pass up a chance to nail them. :jc: :smash:
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 22, 2015, 03:57:17 PM
And the big reason as to why our Country is going through the rough times....
No, the reason our country is going through rough times is that we allow stupid, irresponsible people to breed. You know the type...people who have more kids than they can reasonably afford to care for, don't pay their bills or who think a trip to Disneyworld is more important than fixing their kids' genetically fucked-up teeth...that sort of thing.
Quote from: AbbyTC on July 22, 2015, 10:12:59 PM
I think you're being kind to Troll. ;)
I try to be kind to everyone. Some people just won't allow that though. :biggrin:
Quote from: AbbyTC on July 22, 2015, 10:12:59 PM
I think you're being kind to Troll. ;)
BTW, Welcome the the Zone! I hope you like it here! It gets a little messy sometimes, but it's just that lived-in look. :icon_twisted:
Quote from: Bo D on July 23, 2015, 08:38:44 AM
I try to be kind to everyone. Some people just won't allow that though. :biggrin:
I have tried to over look many of the slams you have made about me. :rolleyes: But you sure want to cry :cry: when someone slams you. Poor baby boy. :cry: You and Henry sure make a good team of criers. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :haha:
Quote from: Exterminator on July 23, 2015, 08:03:23 AM
No, the reason our country is going through rough times is that we allow stupid, irresponsible people to breed. You know the type...people who have more kids than they can reasonably afford to care for, don't pay their bills or who think a trip to Disneyworld is more important than fixing their kids' genetically fucked-up teeth...that sort of thing.
I think you forgot something Exterminator. THEY VOTE REPUBLICAN. :hogslop: :trustme:
Quote from: Bo D on July 23, 2015, 08:49:53 AM
BTW, Welcome the the Zone! I hope you like it here! It gets a little messy sometimes, but it's just that lived-in look. :icon_twisted:
Thank you, Bo! I've looked around and noticed that; very lived in at times.
Maybe I missed it but does it bother anyone that this whole thing started when juvenile records which were supposed to be sealed were released? That they were redacted in such a way that all the victims were revealed? Make me wonder why they were released.
Quote from: Anne on July 25, 2015, 12:16:46 PM
Maybe I missed it but does it bother anyone that this whole thing started when juvenile records which were supposed to be sealed were released? That they were redacted in such a way that all the victims were revealed? Make me wonder why they were released.
In some states, juvenile records aren't sealed so his may not have been. I don't know for certain and some charges can become public record. Don't know and of course, once he turned 18, the records could be public record!
Quote from: Anne on July 25, 2015, 12:16:46 PM
Maybe I missed it but does it bother anyone that this whole thing started when juvenile records which were supposed to be sealed were released? That they were redacted in such a way that all the victims were revealed? Make me wonder why they were released.
It bothers me a lot because it was done to be mean spirited and that is totally uncalled for. Karma will get the person who done this I'm sure.
In Indiana juvenile records are sealed and victim's identities are supposed to be kept from the public record, especially if they are also juveniles. Someone had a personal reason for releasing the records they way they did.
By all means, let's continue to shift the focus away from the serial child molester. :rolleyes:
Quote from: Exterminator on July 28, 2015, 08:02:45 AM
By all means, let's continue to shift the focus away from the serial child molester. :rolleyes:
Are you saying that when you were a little boy, that you didn't try to look under little girl dresses and look into their panties. :confused: :haha: :rotfl:
Quote from: Exterminator on July 28, 2015, 08:02:45 AM
By all means, let's continue to shift the focus away from the serial child molester. :rolleyes:
Seems like that horse has already been beat. Releasing the records is one thing, identifying the victims is another.
I wonder how Josh's supporters here are going to try to explain away his being outed in the recent Ashley Madison hack. (http://gawker.com/family-values-activist-josh-duggar-had-a-paid-ashley-ma-1725132091) There sre those solid Christian values again! :rolleyes:
Quote from: Exterminator on August 20, 2015, 09:37:23 AM
I wonder how Josh's supporters here are going to try to explain away his being outed in the recent Ashley Madison hack. (http://gawker.com/family-values-activist-josh-duggar-had-a-paid-ashley-ma-1725132091) There sre those solid Christian values again! :rolleyes:
Ooooppppssss!
Damn those lying computer records! :icon_twisted:
Oh, wait! It was one of his kids! That's the ticket!
Quote from: Exterminator on August 20, 2015, 09:37:23 AM
I wonder how Josh's supporters here are going to try to explain away his being outed in the recent Ashley Madison hack. (http://gawker.com/family-values-activist-josh-duggar-had-a-paid-ashley-ma-1725132091) There sre those solid Christian values again! :rolleyes:
Jesus did not return calls seeking comments.
Quote from: Exterminator on August 20, 2015, 09:37:23 AM
I wonder how Josh's supporters here are going to try to explain away his being outed in the recent Ashley Madison hack. (http://gawker.com/family-values-activist-josh-duggar-had-a-paid-ashley-ma-1725132091) There sre those solid Christian values again! :rolleyes:
Yeah, the kid is a creep! I gave him the benefit of the doubt....but he gets what he deserves. This is what gives some good Christians a bad name.
What's sad is if it hadn't been for the hacking of Ashley Madison he'd still be doing it.
Josh Duggar Admits to Infidelity: 'I Have Been the Biggest Hypocrite Ever'
Josh Duggar has released a statement calling himself "the biggest hypocrite ever" following media reports that he was a paid user of AshleyMadison.com, a dating website for cheating spouses.
The 27-year-old "19 Kids and Counting" star admitted that he has been viewing porn online and was unfaithful to his wife, writing that he's ashamed of his "double life."
Hackers said this week that they had released the personal data of AshleyMadison.com users. About 32 million accounts were reportedly affected.
This is not the first scandal for Duggar. Back in May, reports surfaced that he had molested five girls in 2002 and 2003 — including four of his sisters.
I have been the biggest hypocrite ever. While espousing faith and family values, I have secretly over the last several years been viewing pornography on the internet and this became a secret addiction and I became unfaithful to my wife.
I am so ashamed of the double life that I have been living and am grieved for the hurt, pain and disgrace my sin has caused my wife and family, and most of all Jesus and all those who profess faith in Him.
I brought hurt and a reproach to my family, close friends and the fans of our show with my actions that happened when I was 14-15 years old, and now I have re-broken their trust.
The last few years, while publicly stating I was fighting against immorality in our country, I was hiding my own personal failings.
As I am learning the hard way, we have the freedom to choose to our actions, but we do not get to choose our consequences. I deeply regret all hurt I have caused so many by being such a bad example.
I humbly ask for your forgiveness. Please pray for my precious wife Anna and our family during this time.
http://insider.foxnews.com/2015/08/20/josh-duggar-responds-reports-ashley-madison-accounts-says-hes-been-unfaithful-his-wife
I wonder? ....
Does anyone think that the Internet is causing (or at least facilitating) this behavior?
Quote from: Bo D on August 21, 2015, 10:42:25 AM
I wonder? ....
Does anyone think that the Internet is causing (or at least facilitating) this behavior?
I'm sure it makes it easier....
Quote from: Bo D on August 21, 2015, 10:42:25 AM
I wonder? ....
Does anyone think that the Internet is causing (or at least facilitating) this behavior?
Yes. Both. But only because of the increased opportunity with less likelihood of being caught. Some people are driven by sex. Others are not. And lots of us fall somewhere in between.
Quote from: Bo D on August 21, 2015, 10:42:25 AM
I wonder? ....
Does anyone think that the Internet is causing (or at least facilitating) this behavior?
If by the 'internet' you mean the things that promote the sick narcissism so prevalent in the 'internet' age, then I'll agree with you and put forth a resounding "yes!"
It's helped create a mass of people who never evolve past the 'me, and what I want' stage.
A little side tale from my decades of internet - and social media - experience...
I always understood that there were narcissists, sociopaths/psychopaths, and other mental/social misfits and mentally/emotionally stunted people in society, but labored under the faulty assumption they were a minute segment of our society...
How wrong I was!
With the trappings of social niceties present from face to face contact removed by the internet, the faces of a multitude of those sick and stupid people were exposed on social media - and it became obvious that they are a FAR greater proportion of the populace than I - or probably anyone - imagined.
Quote from: Y on August 27, 2015, 05:06:21 PM
If by the 'internet' you mean the things that promote the sick narcissism so prevalent in the 'internet' age, then I'll agree with you and put forth a resounding "yes!"
It's helped create a mass of people who never evolve past the 'me, and what I want' stage.
A little side tale from my decades of internet - and social media - experience...
I always understood that there were narcissists, sociopaths/psychopaths, and other mental/social misfits and mentally/emotionally stunted people in society, but labored under the faulty assumption they were a minute segment of our society...
How wrong I was!
With the trappings of social niceties present from face to face contact removed by the internet, the faces of a multitude of those sick and stupid people were exposed on social media - and it became obvious that they are a FAR greater proportion of the populace than I - or probably anyone - imagined.
So ... in a
nutshell :razz: :biggrin: ...
The Internet isn't necessarily causing this behavior. It is merely exposing it.
I like that answer!
Quote from: Bo D on August 27, 2015, 05:23:32 PM
So ... in a nutshell :razz: :biggrin: ...
The Internet isn't necessarily causing this behavior. It is merely exposing it.
I like that answer!
Exposing it and promoting it - of course all for the great god mammon!