Watch the video too - it's a piece of work.
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20012510-503544.html
QuoteFormer GOP presidential candidate, actor and senator Fred Thompson is appearing in a League of American Voters ad pressing Congress to renew the Bush tax cuts, which are set to expire at the end of the year.
Check out Thompson's pitch at left. "Folks, America's economy is struggling, and Congress is about to make it a whole lot worse," he says, warning of the "massive, automatic tax increase" to come if the cuts aren't extended.
Thompson suggests that income taxes could then increase "10 percent or more," while taxes on capital gains will increase 30 percent and taxes on dividends will more than double.
The effects of not renewing the cuts, he says, will be "devastating."
"Devistating"? Not hardly, but I'm sure that I understand why he'd be concerned:
QuoteThe big question is: Is that scary ad correct when it says that if no extension is passed, the pre-2001 tax rates will go back into effect and we'll all be hit with a tax increase in 2011? Yes.
Except that's not the plan. Before you work yourself up into a "death panel" town-hall-level frenzy, you should know that unless you're among the wealthiest American families earning $250,000, your tax cuts won't expire.
Addressing the House Financial Services Committee last week, Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner said President Obama is proposing to leave the tax cuts in place that go to more than 95% of working Americans and "let the tax cuts expire that just go to 2% to 3% of Americans, the highest earning Americans."
http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/news/article.aspx?feed=MY&date=20100802&id=11787146
If someone were to watch the ad and not research it a little, they might be really concerned. :rolleyes: Poor form Mr. Thompson. You've become a part of the spin machine.
What I don't get is that they are trying to say that if the tax cuts are not extended to the 2-3% rich, that somehow it will negatively impact growth and jobs. They have it RIGHT NOW and nothing is happening, just as it will continue to be if they are extended! :rolleyes: They just want to hoard like everybody else, but be more successful in doing so!
Quote from: Palehorse on August 13, 2010, 01:39:27 PM
What I don't get is that they are trying to say that if the tax cuts are not extended to the 2-3% rich, that somehow it will negatively impact growth and jobs. They have it RIGHT NOW and nothing is happening, just as it will continue to be if they are extended! :rolleyes: They just want to hoard like everybody else, but be more successful in doing so!
:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: Fred Thompson afraid of the loss of jobs if the Upper 2% of the Super Rich has their tax back to where it was. It's was the Republicans to to put a time limit of the tax cut.
But to show how lousy the S O B Fred Thompson is. He it trying to get the old people to get a reverse mortgage on their homes. Dave Ramsey the Christian debt consular, who is on radio 1240. Says it's a real bad deal. Too many hidden charges and too much fine print in the contract.
If you can't con the voters you con the old people out of their homes. He's pure shit.
Quote from: The Troll on August 13, 2010, 02:56:49 PM
:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: Fred Thompson afraid of the loss of jobs if the Upper 2% of the Super Rich has their tax back to where it was. It's was the Republicans to to put a time limit of the tax cut.
But to show how lousy the S O B Fred Thompson is. He it trying to get the old people to get a reverse mortgage on their homes. Dave Ramsey the Christian debt consular, who is on radio 1240. Says it's a real bad deal. Too many hidden charges and too much fine print in the contract.
If you can't con the voters you con the old people out of their homes. He's pure shit.
As far as the reverse mortgage on home is concerned I will have to agree and I really hate to see them suck anyone in on that one. I've thought that was a bad idea from day one and the problem is on one realizes it's a problem until the home has to be sold for one reason or another. As for the tax cuts the businesses have no clue whether the tax cuts are going to be extended so they aren't hiring or expanding because they don't know what the future holds and if the tax cuts aren't extended they will not be expanding or hiring so the economy will stay weak or go down even further. What's so hard to understand about that?
Quote from: me on August 13, 2010, 03:08:35 PM
As far as the reverse mortgage on home is concerned I will have to agree and I really hate to see them suck anyone in on that one. I've thought that was a bad idea from day one and the problem is on one realizes it's a problem until the home has to be sold for one reason or another. As for the tax cuts the businesses have no clue whether the tax cuts are going to be extended so they aren't hiring or expanding because they don't know what the future holds and if the tax cuts aren't extended they will not be expanding or hiring so the economy will stay weak or go down even further. What's so hard to understand about that?
Circular logic! They have been in place for years and what have they done?
Nothing! The jobs still left, the factories and businesses still closed, and they are staying that way! Hell, a larger percentage of the wealthy are walking away from their homes than those who are not.
Quote from: Palehorse on August 13, 2010, 03:23:37 PM
Circular logic! They have been in place for years and what have they done? Nothing! The jobs still left, the factories and businesses still closed, and they are staying that way! Hell, a larger percentage of the wealthy are walking away from their homes than those who are not.
That just means they weren't as wealthy as they thought they were and overspent on a larger scale.
Quote from: me on August 13, 2010, 03:27:00 PM
That just means they weren't as wealthy as they thought they were and overspent on a larger scale.
That's BS and you know it. I provided the info elsewhere that proves it too!
Quote from: me on August 13, 2010, 03:08:35 PM
As far as the reverse mortgage on home is concerned I will have to agree and I really hate to see them suck anyone in on that one. I've thought that was a bad idea from day one and the problem is on one realizes it's a problem until the home has to be sold for one reason or another. As for the tax cuts the businesses have no clue whether the tax cuts are going to be extended so they aren't hiring or expanding because they don't know what the future holds and if the tax cuts aren't extended they will not be expanding or hiring so the economy will stay weak or go down even further. What's so hard to understand about that?
I hate to say this, giving the small business people a tax cuts, giving them money or kissing their butts. You can't expand business, if there is no money in the hands of the middle class. Who in hell would add 50 more tables to their 50 table restaurant, if you can only fill 20 tables, no matter how good your food was. You got to have money to eat out.
The American people have lost all of their money living the American dream and having it stolen. In other words, LIVING TO HIGH. For one, buying a $250,0000 house when you can only afford one worth $90,000 which both will be a good home. Buying two new cars when two used ones. Buying second best instead of buying the absolute the best.
But the main reason and the really one the thing that keeping us from coming back. Is free trade. Remember the big eared guy, Perot, that said, "If you sign that NAFTA trade agreement, you will hear a large sucking sound of jobs leaving this country." He sure was right. We have no jobs, no manufacturing base and right now no hope of every having jobs until the dumbasses in Washington changes these unfair trade deals and give the American worker a level playing field.
WE HAVE LOST 48 MILLION JOBS, MOSTLY HIGH PAYING JOBS.
WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE
48,000,000 jobs lost
X$40,000 a year income lost
$1,920,000,000,000 money lost to our economy each and every year. Think about it!
Quote from: The Troll on August 13, 2010, 04:14:33 PM
48,000,000 jobs lost
X$40,000 a year income lost
$1,920,000,000,000 money lost to our economy each and every year. Think about it!
vote republican and save our economy.....
this message was approved by the Henry Hawk for President committee....
Quote from: Henry Hawk on August 13, 2010, 04:16:01 PM
vote republican and save our economy.....
this message was approved by the Henry Hawk for President committee....
:food4:
Quote from: Henry Hawk on August 13, 2010, 04:16:01 PM
vote republican and save our economy.....
this message was approved by the Henry Hawk for President committee....
The Republicans are going to bring back jobs? :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :flap: :flap: :flap:
Who in hell lost them? The Republican Predatory Super Rich Capitalist did. Filling their pocketss at the cost of the American people. :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: Vote Republican and bring back jobs. Ohhhhhhhhhh that so much Bulllllll Shitttttttttttt!!!!!!!!!!!. :flap: :flap: :flap:
Quote from: The Troll on August 13, 2010, 03:49:22 PM
. . .
But the main reason and the really one the thing that keeping us from coming back. Is free trade. Remember the big eared guy, Perot, that said, "If you sign that NAFTA trade agreement, you will hear a large sucking sound of jobs leaving this country." He sure was right. We have no jobs, no manufacturing base and right now no hope of every having jobs until the dumbasses in Washington changes these unfair trade deals and give the American worker a level playing field.
WE HAVE LOST 48 MILLION JOBS, MOSTLY HIGH PAYING JOBS.
WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE
And here he is saying it in 1992:
http://www.youtube.com/v/Rkgx1C_S6ls
Yes, he sure did, and yes he was right. And yes I voted for him back then because I
knew he was right!
http://www.youtube.com/v/GhwhMXOxHTg&NR=1
And here he is in 1993 in a debate on Larry King - with then VP Al Gore - and once again, Ross is spot on!
Quote from: Palehorse on August 13, 2010, 04:40:57 PM
And here he is saying it in 1992:
http://www.youtube.com/v/Rkgx1C_S6ls
Yes, he sure did, and yes he was right. And yes I voted for him back then because I knew he was right!
The condition the country is in now started right after World II. The Republicans have always wanted to destroy Roosevelt's laws. The labor laws, the banking laws, the stock market laws Social Security laws.. These laws were really never under attack until Newt Gingrich's middle class destroying "Contract for American." Where there was a plan to destroy the middle class, Social Security, Medicare, Taft/Hartley law, bank regulations, stock market regulations, labor laws and anything that was good for the middle class working class.
Ronald Reagan, deregulated the air lines and many other things. Ronald Reagan and his Super Rich Predatory Capitalist dream up and wrote up the NAFTA Trade Agreement. All of what Newt Gingrich wanted in his Contract With America. The start of Republican Predatory Capitalism dictatorship. Reagan and the Republican Party planted the seed of destruction of America as we know it.
Richard Nixon, he open China and HE WAS A CROOK. Jerry Ford, who in hell was Jerry Ford.
Now here comes the winner. George W.. The World Trade Order, WTO, and let China into this country. Plus, remember the words. Fast Track Trade Bill. He got that and really fucked up this country. Flat broke and busted and the Republicans wants it back so they can put this country into a Hoover Depression. I say FUCK THEM!
The really dangerous part is that there is a large percentage of American citizens that buy into the lies, half-truths, and scare tactics, and vote accordingly. That is the reason the rich hold the strings to everything and everyone.
Wake up people! It's time to stop being puppets!
Helloooooooooooo.........is anybody in thereeeeeee?????????????? We're talking almost 2yrs and things area getting worse not better and show no signs of improving........hhhhhhhheeeeeeeellllllllllooooooooo
Quote from: me on August 13, 2010, 06:46:55 PM
Helloooooooooooo.........is anybody in thereeeeeee?????????????? We're talking almost 2yrs and things area getting worse not better and show no signs of improving........hhhhhhhheeeeeeeellllllllllooooooooo
Helloooo! So what makes you think letting the super rich keep their money and not pay their fair share of taxes will change that??? Hellooooo! They have it right now and have had it for years, and they still choose to move their operations to Mexico and other nations instead of keeping them here! What don't you get about that?
Quote from: Palehorse on August 13, 2010, 06:49:09 PM
Helloooo! So what makes you think letting the super rich keep their money and not pay their fair share of taxes will change that??? Hellooooo! They have it right now and have had it for years, and they still choose to move their operations to Mexico and other nations instead of keeping them here! What don't you get about that?
And they are moving because of taxes just like they choose the states with the lower taxes they will go to the country with the lower taxes and labor costs.
Quote from: me on August 13, 2010, 07:20:11 PM
And they are moving because of taxes just like they choose the states with the lower taxes they will go to the country with the lower taxes and labor costs.
That's what they may "tell you", but the reality is exactly what Ross Perot said it was back in '92-3, it is the slave wages they get to pay their labor in other countries, and the no healthcare, low cost overhead. . . .
The man KNEW what he was talking about and America chose to suck up the lies that all of his opposition laid out there, because it was the least work. . . Just like they are doing today!
Quote from: Palehorse on August 13, 2010, 06:49:09 PM
Helloooo! So what makes you think letting the super rich keep their money and not pay their fair share of taxes will change that???
Just what do you think their fair share is? How much SHOULD they pay?
The top 25% of the income earners already pay 86% of the federal income tax....and the top 50% pay for 97%....
why was in 1980 when the top income tax rate was 70%, the richest 1% only paid 19% of all the income taxes....?
do you want a plain and simple redistribution of the wealth?........"from each according to his ability, to each according to his need"....is THAT what you want?
Quote from: me on August 13, 2010, 07:20:11 PM
And they are moving because of taxes just like they choose the states with the lower taxes they will go to the country with the lower taxes and labor costs.
This what I have to say to these business that will move because of taxes.
Move right out of the country. Don't pay any taxes to American or the state you were in. You will no longer have to pay anymore money to the United States.
But don't sell any of your god damn foreign shit in this country. We don't need your un-American products. Kiss our ass good by. You leave the country and you can't sell anything you make here and you trademarks and Pations will not be honored in this country any American company can copy and sell you product in this county. Take it or leave it.
Let's see how many would leave. They would cry :cry: to be let back in.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on August 13, 2010, 07:38:53 PM
Just what do you think their fair share is? How much SHOULD they pay?
The top 25% of the income earners already pay 86% of the federal income tax....and the top 50% pay for 97%....
why was in 1980 when the top income tax rate was 70%, the richest 1% only paid 19% of all the income taxes....?
do you want a plain and simple redistribution of the wealth?........"from each according to his ability, to each according to his need"....is THAT what you want?
You are confusing personal income with corporate income; a common error. Apples and oranges. (25% and50% STATEMENT)
Why indeed do the top earners only pay 19% of the total tax revenue collected? You are validating my position that the rich get richer on the shoulders of the poor!
No, a flat tax would be great though. Say, everybody pays the same % of their earnings.
Quote from: The Troll on August 13, 2010, 04:14:33 PM
48,000,000 jobs lost
X$40,000 a year income lost
$1,920,000,000,000 money lost to our economy each and every year. Think about it!
Old PC (predatory capitalist) Henry Hawk will tell you that every time the Indianapolis Colts play in Indianapolis every dollar spent there by the people who see them play. Generates $5. Just think 5 to 1 profit to the city. Just think if you put 48 unemployed back to work.
$1,920,000,000,000
times $5
Equals $9,600,000,000,000 back into the economy.
PC Henry would that help the economy.? :chick: :flap: :flap: :chick:
yes Troll, and I have a new idea.........I think this would be a great compromise to principals you stand on........... to let the unemployed get back to work is to let the private sector employ them....
Give them a year suspended capital gains tax (for ONE year, then reduce from 28% to 15%) to those who invest into American employment or the purchase of American goods....THIS WOULD get Americans BACK to work, (increasing federal revenue lost by the capital gains)....and stir some excitement with American made products...Wall Street would instantly have an erection....
to those who choose NOT to buy American or expand their business with American citizens....then return their capital gains to 35%...
We just spent OVER $787 BILLION nearly two years ago on a stimulus that has NOT shown much sign of any progress.......
I think THIS WOULD without a doubt not only stimulate the economy, but generate real American pride and excitement.....
vote HH for 2012..... :yes:
PC (Predatory Capitalist) Henry, where do you get all of the poison KoolAid :koolaid: that you drink. You must buy it by the tanker load.
You cry about the deficit. But you want to incease it by cutting taxes.
Do you really know how Capital Gain taxes work? DO YOU KNOW HOW CAPITAL GAINS TAXES WORK?
You pay taxes of the profit off the "SALE" of a business, houses you bought for investments, stocks and bonds. Or anything you invested in for the short term and sell at a profit. In other words it the taxes on the profit of using your money. It's like a payroll tax for work. Capital Gains tax is for the profit you make on using money instead of physical work.
You don't pay a God damn dime in taxes on Capital Gains unless you sell. You honestly think that someone who starts a business, runs it for 1 years, he really has to worry about paying Capital Gains Taxes. You think he will sell his business at the end of the year. If he sells his or her business after one year of operation, it is because he or she is bankrupt.
Didn't they teach economics in college. Hell, I learned the hard way, I lived it.
Troll, you caught me.....I have been meaning to say Corporate Tax, instead of Capital Tax...I DO understand the difference, just keep having a brain fart saying Capital Gains...we need to suspend the Corporate Taxes for ONE year...at least on the small business entrepreneur.....THAT, would stimulate the economy instantly.....then apply my logic that it only goes to those who "buy american" clause, and hiring American citizens....THEN, you get the one year break, and the reduction after one year.......
whoops, that makes quite a difference.... :redface:
Quote from: Henry Hawk on August 14, 2010, 09:55:00 AM
Troll, you caught me.....I have been meaning to say Corporate Tax, instead of Capital Tax...I DO understand the difference, just keep having a brain fart saying Capital Gains...we need to suspend the Corporate Taxes for ONE year...at least on the small business entrepreneur.....THAT, would stimulate the economy instantly.....then apply my logic that it only goes to those who "buy american" clause, and hiring American citizens....THEN, you get the one year break, and the reduction after one year.......
whoops, that makes quite a difference.... :redface:
I would go along with that, but I want one thing. The companies pay no taxes, but they absolutely do not get any deductions for anyting. Plus they receive no government aid in any form. No government grants. In other words the business that take the no taxes program is cut off from the government trough. No nothing.
Maybe one more thing. You take the no taxes, you can not lobby the congress or donate to any political party or voting campaign. Absolutely nothing political.
Yeah, I would go for this. I really like this. You know a company doesn't pay taxes anyway. Any expense they have is passed along to the customer. You know it and I know it. Anyone who has been in business knows that. The Corporate tax issue is a Red Herring issue anyway. It's all bull shit. It's all planned to get us to take our eyes off of what's really happening.
Quote from: The Troll on August 14, 2010, 10:19:58 AM
I would go along with that, but I want one thing. The companies pay no taxes, but they absolutely do not get any deductions for anyting. Plus they receive no government aid in any form. No government grants. In other words the business that take the no taxes program is cut off from the government trough. No nothing.
Maybe one more thing. You take the no taxes, you can not lobby the congress or donate to any political party or voting campaign. Absolutely nothing political.
Yeah, I would go for this. I really like this. You know a company doesn't pay taxes anyway. Any expense they have is passed along to the customer. You know it and I know it. Anyone who has been in business knows that. The Corporate tax issue is a Red Herring issue anyway. It's all bull shit. It's all planned to get us to take our eyes off of what's really happening.
IF the hawk was potus.....I would reform our tax system to a flat tax...our current tax system is a complicated failure that is keeping this economy from being what it once was...it is set up to allow those with the money to cheat its way into prosperity...the tax codes would go away along with the vast majority of the IRS.....folks WITH a family, making less than 30 or 40 grand would NOT pay any taxes....
the tax rate may have a slow increase up to those who made $250k, after that would stay the same no mater how much you make....the rich would pay more taxes, and it would be fair.
also,
1.) I would ban pork projects, that is NOT what federal tax dollars are for....those are up to the States to spend....
2.) I would make ALL federal Grants, Public....we hard working Americans have the "right" to know how the federal government is distributing grants and money, no more secret spending....
3.) I would impose TERM LIMITS...elected officials would have a limited time to serve....congress could have four terms, and senate would have two terms....
4.) Our Military would have the same "healthcare and benifits" as those in Washington....
5.) Having a mandatory cap on spending, with a set annual budget........once we exceeded our budget, a freeze on all spending would be inflicted......it woud only take ONE time for this to happen before the Americans would take elections MORE serious.
just a few thought I would be excited about to fix this economy....
Quote from: Henry Hawk on August 14, 2010, 11:00:07 AM
IF the hawk was potus.....I would reform our tax system to a flat tax...our current tax system is a complicated failure that is keeping this economy from being what it once was...it is set up to allow those with the money to cheat its way into prosperity...the tax codes would go away along with the vast majority of the IRS.....folks WITH a family, making less than 30 or 40 grand would NOT pay any taxes....
the tax rate may have a slow increase up to those who made $250k, after that would stay the same no mater how much you make....the rich would pay more taxes, and it would be fair.
also,
1.) I would ban pork projects, that is NOT what federal tax dollars are for....those are up to the States to spend....
2.) I would make ALL federal Grants, Public....we hard working Americans have the "right" to know how the federal government is distributing grants and money, no more secret spending....
3.) I would impose TERM LIMITS...elected officials would have a limited time to serve....congress could have four terms, and senate would have two terms....
4.) Our Military would have the same "healthcare and benifits" as those in Washington....
5.) Having a mandatory cap on spending, with a set annual budget........once we exceeded our budget, a freeze on all spending would be inflicted......it woud only take ONE time for this to happen before the Americans would take elections MORE serious.
just a few thought I would be excited about to fix this economy....
[/
I am only going to talk about one thing now. THERE WOULD BE NO FLAT TAX.
If some one like John Kerry and John McCain and a whole lot of super rich peope. Can have 6 or 7 multimillion dollar houses, yachts, fleet of new expensive cars, a jet plane, homes overseas. They sure can pay more in taxes. I sure don't want them to pay the same taxes poor people pay. They sure can pay more taxes to be able to live in this country.
You been listen to Neal Borst, Cal Thomas and the Heritage Foundation too much. It all a con job on the middle class. It was made up by the rich so they wouldn't have to pay taxes. Pure greed.
there is NOTHING greedy about it Troll.........this land is all about freedom and liberty....NOT about government control......and THAT is where we disagree the most....YOU want OUR government to control the people.......fair is fair.......on a flat tax, with ALL of the loop holes gone, the rich would pay their fair share...
IF, a guy made 20 million a year, on a 20% flat tax, he would pay $4 million in taxes! If you made $100,000, you pay 20,000....
why do you want to penalize those who work hard to get ahead?
I think Neal Bortz is very correct with his analogy of a fair tax.....there is NO con job....
Honestly I think YOU are being CONNED by democrat politicians, who make you think THEY can make this a better Country...by "control".....the libs WANT control.....why can't you see this?
they want to control what we eat, what we drive, what we live in, what we set our thermostats at, how much we make...and on and on....THAT is not what our forefathers had in mind when they developed our government.....
I will say that the "republican" party is NOT what I think they should be either......
I want a "limited" government........I'm good with SOME regulation, SOME oversight, but they are there to make laws to protect us, NOT hinder us. We need to enforce a few laws, swiftly and in some cases severely.....but, keeping Americans SAFE is first and foremost.
try reading some of the heritage foundation with an open mind, and they CAN make a whole lot of sense....
Aye, matey.
"Limited" and "hinder" are judgment words.
Our elected officials are entrusted to apply them, along with lots of others.
And there's the rub.
One man's meat is another man's poison, one man's junk is another man's treasure, one man's hinder is another man's help, etc.
And on and on and on.
So you're on one side and other people here are on the opposite side.
Been that way since the country was formed, and we'll be chewing the same bone when the Earth explodes.
I guess that is why we have elections...as long as freedom and liberty are it's roots...
Quote from: Henry Hawk on August 14, 2010, 02:11:56 PM
I guess that is why we have elections...as long as freedom and liberty are it's roots...
After reading all of your posts over the months, on all of the blathering about how oppressed the super rich are, how we abuse them by trying to keep the poor darlings down. My God I can't believe you came from blue collar, middle class people. Where did you get all of this compassion for the super rich. The same people who would give you the back of the hand if you asked for the time of day and would let you starve to death.
There is an island at Gulf Shores Alabama, it's called Ono Island, where all of the Super Rich have one of their second or third homes. This is also the place where a beach front lot cost $350,000.
The only way you're, yes you Hawk, going to get on that island is over the bridge, through armed police barricade with control arm and having written permission or voice permission to even drive on a road on that island. And yet you want to kiss their rich ass. It is truly unbelievable how anyone from the middle class would vote against their own self interest. You sure would and sure have.
So tell me what classes did you take in college to come to the beliefs you have. What books have you read on the subject and authors that have lead you to your unbelievable beliefs.
Son you don't make sense to this old man, who worked all of his life for these authoritarian greedy bastards.
Maybe one of these days, your are going to find out these rich bastards don't give a damn about you or your family or your station in life. If it happens soon, in this economy, you and your family is truly going to be hurt. I'm not mean enough to wish it would happen to you. But I know what happened to my son who lost his job last year and could find one for 4 months and he doesn't have 5 kids.
Quote from: The Troll on August 14, 2010, 05:17:15 PM
After reading all of your posts over the months, on all of the blathering about how oppressed the super rich are, how we abuse them by trying to keep the poor darlings down. My God I can't believe you came from blue collar, middle class people. Where did you get all of this compassion for the super rich. The same people who would give you the back of the hand if you asked for the time of day and would let you starve to death.
There is an island at Gulf Shores Alabama, it's called Ono Island, where all of the Super Rich have one of their second or third homes. This is also the place where a beach front lot cost $350,000.
The only way you're, yes you Hawk, going to get on that island is over the bridge, through armed police barricade with control arm and having written permission or voice permission to even drive on a road on that island. And yet you want to kiss their rich ass. It is truly unbelievable how anyone from the middle class would vote against their own self interest. You sure would and sure have.
So tell me what classes did you take in college to come to the beliefs you have. What books have you read on the subject and authors that have lead you to your unbelievable beliefs.
Son you don't make sense to this old man, who worked all of his life for these authoritarian greedy bastards.
Maybe one of these days, your are going to find out these rich bastards don't give a damn about you or your family or your station in life. If it happens soon, in this economy, you and your family is truly going to be hurt. I'm not mean enough to wish it would happen to you. But I know what happened to my son who lost his job last year and could find one for 4 months and he doesn't have 5 kids.
Who paid you? What all did you say you owned and had done with the wages they paid you? And you say you have benefits still. Did you expect them to pay you the same as they made? Hum, makes no sense that you want the very people who gave you all you have to not profit from what they worked to be able to give to you. A lot of these people who have these businesses started at the bottom and worked their way up. If you've never owned a business you have no idea what that end of it is. Yes, large corporations are a little different and an owner could suddenly find himself on the outside of his business looking in if he happens to get ousted by the BOD but the worker in no way deserves to be paid the same as an owner nor should he expect to be. Yes, owners should provide safe working conditions, yes, they should pay a fair wage, and yes, they should pay taxes. You and a lot of others are of a mind set that they, owners and corporations, should allow you to come in and
work maybe 3hrs, I'm saying that because of break times, and get paid for 8, get super duper benefits paid for by them, get paid vacations, and make $20 or more pr hour. On top of that you want them to pay more in taxes. No wonder they all are moving to Mexico and other countries. And before you come unglued yes, your job was not an easy one but I'm talking about the average factory worker who isn't subjected to what you were as a millwright?
Quote from: me on August 14, 2010, 09:56:20 PMWho paid you? What all did you say you owned and had done with the wages they paid you? And you say you have benefits still. Did you expect them to pay you the same as they made? Hum, makes no sense that you want the very people who gave you all you have to not profit from what they worked to be able to give to you. A lot of these people who have these businesses started at the bottom and worked their way up. If you've never owned a business you have no idea what that end of it is. Yes, large corporations are a little different and an owner could suddenly find himself on the outside of his business looking in if he happens to get ousted by the BOD but the worker in no way deserves to be paid the same as an owner nor should he expect to be. Yes, owners should provide safe working conditions, yes, they should pay a fair wage, and yes, they should pay taxes. You and a lot of others are of a mind set that they, owners and corporations, should allow you to come in and work maybe 3hrs, I'm saying that because of break times, and get paid for 8, get super duper benefits paid for by them, get paid vacations, and make $20 or more pr hour. On top of that you want them to pay more in taxes. No wonder they all are moving to Mexico and other countries. And before you come unglued yes, your job was not an easy one but I'm talking about the average factory worker who isn't subjected to what you were as a millwright?
Sweet heart who is suppose to own Ford Motor Company and who owns BP. The stock holders are suppose to own them. The super rich at the top of these companies thinks it's their own piggy bank.
Last year the 6 top Ford executives split $60 million dollars between themselves in salary and bonus. $60 million dollars for 6 men for one year of going into work. You think that alright. Bull Shit.
Tony Hayword of BP who killed the Gulf of Mexico is going to get an immediate pension of $900,000 a year retirement, for life. The poor bastard. The Super Rich deserves all the money they can get and we have "ME" waving them on. You have to be brain dead.
Quote from: The Troll on August 14, 2010, 10:35:19 PM
Sweet heart who is suppose to own Ford Motor Company and who owns BP. The stock holders are suppose to own them. The super rich at the top of these companies thinks it's their own piggy bank.
Last year the 6 top Ford executives split $60 million dollars between themselves in salary and bonus. $60 million dollars for 6 men for one year of going into work. You think that alright. Bull Shit.
Tony Hayword of BP who killed the Gulf of Mexico is going to get an immediate pension of $900,000 a year retirement, for life. The poor bastard. The Super Rich deserves all the money they can get and we have "ME" waving them on. You have to be brain dead.
It is still not the governments job to run companies and set salaries. Do you think they should earn the same amount you do or that you should earn the same amount they do? BP is a British company and it damn sure isn't any of our governments business what they pay their CEO's. The only thing you come across as being is jealous of what they have because you don't have it and you want your share. I"m sorry but it don't work that way in the real world.
Quote from: me on August 15, 2010, 02:52:39 AMIt is still not the governments job to run companies and set salaries. Do you think they should earn the same amount you do or that you should earn the same amount they do? BP is a British company and it damn sure isn't any of our governments business what they pay their CEO's. The only thing you come across as being is jealous of what they have because you don't have it and you want your share. I"m sorry but it don't work that way in the real world.
Well Baby Cakes, just where is BP making their money and who's Gulf did they screw up. Don't give me that bull shit, "Well,, they're a foreign company. Yeah, a foreign taking our money and fouling up out country.
I have never said that people should not make large amounts of money. Inventors, Authors, Song Writers, The people who started their own business, people who did it themselves.
But you can kiss my butt if you think I'm for some Assholes giving themselves such ungodly wages as the bunch in the Banking, Stock Market and the CEO and the lackeys at the top sucking all of the profit out of the company and giving it to themselves. And you protect them. The same people who lay off people, out source the jobs and pay off Congress gives themselves bonus for it.
Someone who, from what they have said, don't two dimes to rub together wants to kiss their ass. Hell, their buying Congress as I write now. How much money are they giving you for your defense of them.
I'd bet my next Social Security check they haven't given you a dime. Want to bet.
Quote from: me on August 14, 2010, 09:56:20 PM
Hum, makes no sense that you want the very people who gave you all you have...
This is the crux of the problem,
me. They didn't
give him anything. He earned it. Those benefits you seem to begrudge him were part of the price of his skilled labor. No factory on earth is run by Santa Claus.
I have a job I love, and a great boss. He
gives me a birthday gift and a Christmas bonus every year. I
earn every dime of the rest of my compensation. If he paid less, he would have to settle for an employee who lacks some of my skills. If he needs a person with more skills than I have, it will cost him more than he pays me.
The same is true of every business that ever existed. When entry-level people can do the same job with the same competency as those who have been on the job for twenty years, the twenty-year guys get down-sized. That's just good business.
But when a company hires a son-in-law -- or a golfing buddy, or just somebody who watched them bury a body -- who has no particular skills that can't be found on every street corner, at an inflated salary with bonuses and stock options, it isn't good business. It's just greed.
Next time you go to your bank, ask yourself exactly what the executive vice president does differently, or better, than the third-year loan underwriter. And then ask if those one or two things he at which he might be a little more skilled actually justify that $120,000 difference in pay.
Quote from: LOsborne on August 15, 2010, 09:17:23 AM
This is the crux of the problem, me. They didn't give him anything. He earned it. Those benefits you seem to begrudge him were part of the price of his skilled labor. No factory on earth is run by Santa Claus.
I have a job I love, and a great boss. He gives me a birthday gift and a Christmas bonus every year. I earn every dime of the rest of my compensation. If he paid less, he would have to settle for an employee who lacks some of my skills. If he needs a person with more skills than I have, it will cost him more than he pays me.
The same is true of every business that ever existed. When entry-level people can do the same job with the same competency as those who have been on the job for twenty years, the twenty-year guys get down-sized. That's just good business.
But when a company hires a son-in-law -- or a golfing buddy, or just somebody who watched them bury a body -- who has no particular skills that can't be found on every street corner, at an inflated salary with bonuses and stock options, it isn't good business. It's just greed.
Next time you go to your bank, ask yourself exactly what the executive vice president does differently, or better, than the third-year loan underwriter. And then ask if those one or two things he at which he might be a little more skilled actually justify that $120,000 difference in pay.
I guess a little better choice of words where I said gave would have been paid. Sorry 'bout that. As far as the rest of it, it stands as written.
Quote from: The Troll on August 14, 2010, 05:17:15 PM
After reading all of your posts over the months, on all of the blathering about how oppressed the super rich are, how we abuse them by trying to keep the poor darlings down. My God I can't believe you came from blue collar, middle class people. Where did you get all of this compassion for the super rich. The same people who would give you the back of the hand if you asked for the time of day and would let you starve to death.
There is an island at Gulf Shores Alabama, it's called Ono Island, where all of the Super Rich have one of their second or third homes. This is also the place where a beach front lot cost $350,000.
The only way you're, yes you Hawk, going to get on that island is over the bridge, through armed police barricade with control arm and having written permission or voice permission to even drive on a road on that island. And yet you want to kiss their rich ass. It is truly unbelievable how anyone from the middle class would vote against their own self interest. You sure would and sure have.
So tell me what classes did you take in college to come to the beliefs you have. What books have you read on the subject and authors that have lead you to your unbelievable beliefs.
Son you don't make sense to this old man, who worked all of his life for these authoritarian greedy bastards.
Maybe one of these days, your are going to find out these rich bastards don't give a damn about you or your family or your station in life. If it happens soon, in this economy, you and your family is truly going to be hurt. I'm not mean enough to wish it would happen to you. But I know what happened to my son who lost his job last year and could find one for 4 months and he doesn't have 5 kids.
Maybe we need to define "rich"..........I am MORE concerned about the small business man, that makes up the vast majority of employment in this land.....I'm talking about the guy who is making $200,000 plus...THOSE guys are the ones who are keeping the blue collar guy busy....
I am NOT compassionate about the BIG assed Corporate world...but, the bottom line is our government does NOT need to be dictating who, what, when and where to ANY business...
If you want to talk about your "authoritarian greedy bastards"..THAT is what our Government is!!!!
and they are at an all time record of being so....
Troll, for someone who has made a very comfortable living OFF of these bastards that you complain of, you sure don't seem to be very grateful...
and dude, I can careless about any Ono Island....the "super rich" can have it....I just want to keep my job, pay my bills and raise my family....my middle class family values taught me that.....
and another thing, IF, we could quit having government run this and gov run that....and let the entrepreneurs of country, do their thing, without gov interference....then JOB's for you son may be more plentiful....
again, I'm not about the super rich getting super richer, but we got to quit beating the shit out of the business' that are trying their best to keep it's head above water...I work for such a company....and so far, he is keeping his people busy, but I don't know how much longer he can sustain this before our Government makes it worse.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on August 15, 2010, 09:36:58 AM
quit beating the shit out of the business' that are trying their best to keep it's head above water...I work for such a company....and so far, he is keeping his people busy, but I don't know how much longer he can sustain this before our Government makes it worse.
Please tell me just what the Federal Government is doing to kill you company. Hell, the Republicans just turn down a bill that was to help the small business man.
Come on, tell me just what the the government is doing against your company. Sure we have Building Codes, which I think you would say we need. What else are they doing to kill it.
Hell, we have to have laws to keep the bad companies from taking over the good companies. Don't you agree. Or do we just turn everybody loose and let them build, steal, and sell shitty products.
But it really gets me, "WE GOT TO HELP THE SMALL BUSSINESS MAN, SO HE CAN HELP US."
Yeah, helping us. Paying minimum wages or under the table, we have a pizza shop here in town, the guy that owns it, own 3 others pizza stores. He's pay his people under the table, cash. He is paying the minimum wage, he doesn't want to break that law.
They pay no benefits.
They won't let their people 40 hours, so they don't have to worry about paying unemployment.
And a whole lot don't pay the proper income tax, they cheat on the income tax.
There's a Sub Food shop in Ruskin Florida. It has good subs. I made friend with the lady who ran it. We were talking about wages. She said, she work for this guy, who live on the beach and does nothing with his business except take in the money. This honest small business man pays this woman $55 a day for 10 hours. Cash under the table. She has no help and runs the business by herself, 6 days a week.
She had made a mistake on one of the subs she was making for me. I said, at least you get to eat the mistakes. She said, Hell no, the greedy bastard make me take them to his accountant. I said he won't even let you eat free. She said, hell no, no potato chips, no cold drinks no nothing.
This woman, single mother with two kids, makes $330 a week for 6 days. Oh my god do we need more small business men like him. God bless him for hiring these poor people. He's such good people. One of the problems there is a whole lot of People in small business just like him. Cheating greed.
If someone were truely concerned about the little guy, you'd think that you'd want the big guy to pay his real share in taxes. Someone has to, we have bills to pay.
if he is breaking the law, and it sounds like he IS, then he should go to jail......it is THAT simple. Why isn't he?
and NO one is putting a gun to anyone's head to work for him....that lady CHOSE to work for him...I bet the people buy the subs are not complaining for a great sub at a great price....I bet they don't give a rats ass IF that woman is making 50 bucks a day.....and THAT does suck, but the greedy is JUST not with the owners, the customers are greedy too.......that is why Walmart is doing so well.....
I agree with you that it is time for Americans to decide WHAT they want....American jobs or cheap shit....
I have given you MY ways of running things....and it is not a republican thing either...it is just a common sense thing...
and Troll, this current federal gov is always proposing policies that spend, tax, and borrow way too much of our money, and they continue to expand the size and scope of the federal government...and that is a hindering our economic growth, which in return IS KILLING small business....to me it is so freakin simple to see, and just as easy to fix....but, we are killing this nation as we speak.....you can blame Bush, and republicans ALL you want, but the problem IS and HAS been, TOO MUCH SPENDING AND EXPANDING OF OUR GOVERNMENT....
Quote from: Henry Hawk on August 15, 2010, 04:30:07 PM
if he is breaking the law, and it sounds like he IS, then he should go to jail......it is THAT simple. Why isn't he?
and NO one is putting a gun to anyone's head to work for him....that lady CHOSE to work for him...I bet the people buy the subs are not complaining for a great sub at a great price....I bet they don't give a rats ass IF that woman is making 50 bucks a day.....and THAT does suck, but the greedy is JUST not with the owners, the customers are greedy too.......that is why Walmart is doing so well.....
I agree with you that it is time for Americans to decide WHAT they want....American jobs or cheap shit....
I have given you MY ways of running things....and it is not a republican thing either...it is just a common sense thing...
and Troll, this current federal gov is always proposing policies that spend, tax, and borrow way too much of our money, and they continue to expand the size and scope of the federal government...and that is a hindering our economic growth, which in return IS KILLING small business....to me it is so freakin simple to see, and just as easy to fix....but, we are killing this nation as we speak.....you can blame Bush, and republicans ALL you want, but the problem IS and HAS been, TOO MUCH SPENDING AND EXPANDING OF OUR GOVERNMENT....
PC Hawk, your only solution to this economy is. Quit spending money. Cut taxes. Quit spending, cut taxes, cut taxes, quit spending, cut taxes.
You want to do what Herbert Hoover's idea of getting us out the depression. The Super Rich and the corporations they own are hording money, the American don't have extra money to spend, who in hell is left to get this economy going, it's the American Government.
Let talk about the Subs, they were not cheap. They tasted good because the woman made them good. Why did she work for him. Because there hardly wasn't any close jobs to work. The only jobs that were to be had paid around $6.20 or less. To take one of them, she would have to pay tax, Buy a car and pay for gas. She walked to work.
Why I didn't turn in the greedy bastard was, he would have lost the store and she would lose her job. If things were different I would have turned him. But being in Florida, it wouldn't have went anywere.
I sure would like to see how well your boss lives and his relation who work in the business. I'll bet a S.S. check he's living high in his million dollar house and the things that goes with that.
Quote from: The Troll on August 15, 2010, 08:20:00 PM
PC Hawk, your only solution to this economy is. Quit spending money. Cut taxes. Quit spending, cut taxes, cut taxes, quit spending, cut taxes.
You want to do what Herbert Hoover's idea of getting us out the depression. The Super Rich and the corporations they own are hording money, the American don't have extra money to spend, who in hell is left to get this economy going, it's the American Government.
Let talk about the Subs, they were not cheap. They tasted good because the woman made them good. Why did she work for him. Because there hardly wasn't any close jobs to work. The only jobs that were to be had paid around $6.20 or less. To take one of them, she would have to pay tax, Buy a car and pay for gas. She walked to work.
Why I didn't turn in the greedy bastard was, he would have lost the store and she would lose her job. If things were different I would have turned him. But being in Florida, it wouldn't have went anywere.
I sure would like to see how well your boss lives and his relation who work in the business. I'll bet a S.S. check he's living high in his million dollar house and the things that goes with that.
And that, my dear sir, is the privilege of owning the business. You would be like the people who worked for me when I had my business. I realized one day that the employees actually made more than I did and I was working right along side them and they thought if I wasn't working they didn't have to either. That was my fault since I don't see myself as any better than they are and wasn't about to have them do anything I wouldn't be willing to do. If I had been a little smarter I would have done things differently. No, I didn't close it because it wasn't doing good I closed it because I couldn't find people willing to work. And, no, I will not reveal what kind of business it was on a public forum.
Quote from: me on August 15, 2010, 10:15:27 PM
No, I didn't close it because it wasn't doing good I closed it because I couldn't find people willing to work.
Or was it, I couldn't find the people to the hard dirty job at the wage I was willing to pay. I really did some filthy work, but Ford paid what I thought it was worth. Would I have done it for $5, $10, NO,$15 maybe and at $20 per hour bring it on.
Or you could have had a job "NOBODY IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WOULD DO." Say, removing anti-personell mines for minumum wage.
One guy started a business that cleaned up after murders, suicides, Building and rooms where bodies had rotted for weeks in the summer, blood on the walls and ceilings. He said he had a hard time finding someone to do the job. When he found one he paid very good.
Or you could have been like one of the owners of a Steel Pipe and fittings the big heavy duty plumbing material company.
One day my uncle was setting out of the sight of the owner and his son, who was the sales manager. The son was complaining about my uncle was making more money that he was. The owner said to the boy. Do you want to go out into the field like he does. The boy said no. The owner said then forget about it. I don't care how much money Bob makes, the more the better. Because he isn't going to make more than me. My uncle said that was OK with him.
So if they were making more money than you and you were working physically harder than them. You needed a course in management. Your suppose to work your mind not your body. I think most good workers know that, your the boss.
But for some reason, I think a company owner who makes over $300,000 a year after he has payed all the cost of doing business and he cleared over $300,000 he is not a small business man. In other words he not starving to death.
Quote from: The Troll on August 16, 2010, 12:07:42 AM
Or was it, I couldn't find the people to the hard dirty job at the wage I was willing to pay. I really did some filthy work, but Ford paid what I thought it was worth. Would I have done it for $5, $10, NO,$15 maybe and at $20 per hour bring it on.
Or you could have had a job "NOBODY IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WOULD DO." Say, removing anti-personell mines for minumum wage.
One guy started a business that cleaned up after murders, suicides, Building and rooms where bodies had rotted for weeks in the summer, blood on the walls and ceilings. He said he had a hard time finding someone to do the job. When he found one he paid very good.
Or you could have been like one of the owners of a Steel Pipe and fittings the big heavy duty plumbing material company.
One day my uncle was setting out of the sight of the owner and his son, who was the sales manager. The son was complaining about my uncle was making more money that he was. The owner said to the boy. Do you want to go out into the field like he does. The boy said no. The owner said then forget about it. I don't care how much money Bob makes, the more the better. Because he isn't going to make more than me. My uncle said that was OK with him.
So if they were making more money than you and you were working physically harder than them. You needed a course in management. Your suppose to work your mind not your body. I think most good workers know that, your the boss.
But for some reason, I think a company owner who makes over $300,000 a year after he has payed all the cost of doing business and he cleared over $300,000 he is not a small business man. In other words he not starving to death.
Your comment about the boss living high while the poor workers slave away isn't always necessarily so and what does that have to do with anything anyway. You said yourself if managed properly the owner should make more money than the employee and yes, I did manage my business poorly in that aspect because I have a peon mindset and did not think of myself as an "owner" I still thought of myself as a worker and you can't do that. You mentioned that sub shop and didn't say if it was a franchise or not, which I doubt if it was, and if it wasn't that's probably all he could afford to pay and was lucky to find someone who would work for what that lady did. Yes, he should have had at least one more employee in case she got sick or needed to be off for some reason. Did you ever think she may not have been being entirely truthful with you? Saving the mistakes to take to the accountant doesn't even make sense if you think about it and if he did the accountant was laughing his head off at the guy because that would be no proof to the IRS for a deduction of any kind. You are judging that owner without knowing all the facts based on something the employee told you who may not have been telling you the truth.
What, to you, constitutes a small business? The way you talk the person who owns the 4 pizza parlors is not considered a small business owner. How do you know what or how he pays? Have you looked at his books to know what his expenses are and how much he clears? How much do you think those pizzas would cost if he paid more than minimum wage plus benefits?
Quote from: me on August 15, 2010, 10:15:27 PM
And, no, I will not reveal what kind of business it was on a public forum.
LOL! Very convenient but selling Amway doesn't constitute owning a business.
Quote from: The Troll on August 15, 2010, 08:20:00 PM
I sure would like to see how well your boss lives and his relation who work in the business. I'll bet a S.S. check he's living high in his million dollar house and the things that goes with that.
and what in the hell is WRONG if he did?.........HE is the one who built a company from scratch...it is HIS money that is being reinvested, so that WE can have jobs....WTF is the manner with YOU guys?
and for the record, he does NOT live in a million dollar home.....he has a very nice home, with some very nice vehicles, and I am very sure he has money that if he wanted to, he could sell the business and live very comfortable for the rest of his life...NOT everyone who has money are pricks....
Troll, if it was up to YOU, you would demand that this guy give UP a few of his cars, and MORE of HIS money so that YOU can buy one or two of those cars and live in a nicer home....
I do consider myself very fortunate to have such a boss......and I WANT him to continue to be successful, because when HE is successful, I am successful...
Quote from: Henry Hawk on August 16, 2010, 07:36:07 AM
and what in the hell is WRONG if he did?.........HE is the one who built a company from scratch...it is HIS money that is being reinvested, so that WE can have jobs....WTF is the manner with YOU guys?
and for the record, he does NOT live in a million dollar home.....he has a very nice home, with some very nice vehicles, and I am very sure he has money that if he wanted to, he could sell the business and live very comfortable for the rest of his life...NOT everyone who has money are pricks....
Troll, if it was up to YOU, you would demand that this guy give UP a few of his cars, and MORE of HIS money so that YOU can buy one or two of those cars and live in a nicer home....
I do consider myself very fortunate to have such a boss......and I WANT him to continue to be successful, because when HE is successful, I am successful...
To cover the Twins questions.
Why would the woman lie to me. She had no reason. The accountant took care of all of his little businesses deals. The idea of taking the mistakes, bad food, was to keep her straight, "So she wouldn't cheat or steal." The business was set up like he was the only one operating it. It's how tax evaders work, "ME"
Now, if you were selling Amway products, and I had several people I knew tried and failed. All of them tried to get me to sell them. I seen all of the tapes of the big homes, the big RVs and the marvelous vacations the people were suppose to get as Amyway salesman and district managers to state managers and so on. I told her, Judy you don't have a protection from other people coming in and moving across the street selling Amyway. Come to find out there were 3 people trying to sell Amway in this small town.
Well, I thought it was and the research on Amway, it was a pyramid game. Beside being crookedly ran, the only ones that made money in this scam was the family members and family friends and their family. There was no way an outsider was going to make any money.
My stepsister, tried so hard to get me in it and I tried so hard to keep her out. Well, she took the plunge and at the end of the game she had a room of unwanted Amway products which she had over $8,000 of her money in. So don't tell me I don't know about Amway. I was a scam.
The funny thing was my stepsister had worked for Walmart. I told her "How in hell are you, from your house and telephone going to compete with Walmart, selling the same things they sell."
Now the other twin. There you go again putting words in my mouth. Did you read my post where I said that I was for people to did it on their own, could make all of the money they wanted.
He's the people I want to make big money. Not the Tony Hayward of BP. who got out of college and the CEO of BP put Tony under his wing and up the ladder he went. Because of his mismanagement of BP created the world largest oil spill, is retired, to get him out of sight, $900,000 a year retirement. Wrong!!!
Now your boss, what you say, well that's great. But if he's making over $300,000 a year, clear, after he's paid you and every thing to run his business and he's ran straight and honest books. I don't see why putting the tax rate back to where it was is going to change his life style so drastically.
The Republicans gave that limited time tax cut. Why would it put him out of business if his taxes was raised back to the original 2% more.
If you have read any of my post and really took it of what I have said, I HAVE NOTHING AGAINST A PERSON WHO DID IT HIMSELF, GETTING RICH. Ross Perot, Bill Lear and Henry Ford before he began thinking he was god.
But the people like the 6 guys from Ford, splitting $6 million dollars of Ford stockholders money, the top leaches of the big banks and stock market making billions of dollars with fraud. Now I think that's unfair and unjust. I hate the Super Rich Predatory Capitalist bastards, let me say again, I HATE THE SUPER RICH "PREDATORY" CAPITALIST BASTARDS, Sorry!
Quote from: The Troll on August 16, 2010, 08:50:15 AM
I hate the Super Rich Predatory Capitalist bastards, let me say again, I HATE THE SUPER RICH "PREDATORY" CAPITALIST BASTARDS, Sorry!
I understand, and I am not a fan by any means of MOST of those "bastards".........but, equally, I don't lke the SUPER RICH "PREDATORY" BIG GOVERNMENT BASTARDS, much either....
Quote from: Exterminator on August 16, 2010, 07:33:14 AM
LOL! Very convenient but selling Amway doesn't constitute owning a business.
It was not a sales business and it's none of your business what it was. Also it was successful I just couldn't get decent help which used to be a problem for most everyone. Everyone had Troll's attitude that I should pay factory wages and that just wasn't going to happen because it wasn't a skilled trade type job. I paid better than other businesses in that same category I found out later and no one appreciated it they instead took advantage of it.
Quote from: The Troll on August 16, 2010, 08:50:15 AM
To cover the Twins questions.
Why would the woman lie to me. She had no reason. The accountant took care of all of his little businesses deals. The idea of taking the mistakes, bad food, was to keep her straight, "So she wouldn't cheat or steal." The business was set up like he was the only one operating it. It's how tax evaders work, "ME"
Now, if you were selling Amway products, and I had several people I knew tried and failed. All of them tried to get me to sell them. I seen all of the tapes of the big homes, the big RVs and the marvelous vacations the people were suppose to get as Amyway salesman and district managers to state managers and so on. I told her, Judy you don't have a protection from other people coming in and moving across the street selling Amyway. Come to find out there were 3 people trying to sell Amway in this small town.
Well, I thought it was and the research on Amway, it was a pyramid game. Beside being crookedly ran, the only ones that made money in this scam was the family members and family friends and their family. There was no way an outsider was going to make any money.
My stepsister, tried so hard to get me in it and I tried so hard to keep her out. Well, she took the plunge and at the end of the game she had a room of unwanted Amway products which she had over $8,000 of her money in. So don't tell me I don't know about Amway. I was a scam.
The funny thing was my stepsister had worked for Walmart. I told her "How in hell are you, from your house and telephone going to compete with Walmart, selling the same things they sell."
Now the other twin. There you go again putting words in my mouth. Did you read my post where I said that I was for people to did it on their own, could make all of the money they wanted.
He's the people I want to make big money. Not the Tony Hayward of BP. who got out of college and the CEO of BP put Tony under his wing and up the ladder he went. Because of his mismanagement of BP created the world largest oil spill, is retired, to get him out of sight, $900,000 a year retirement. Wrong!!!
Now your boss, what you say, well that's great. But if he's making over $300,000 a year, clear, after he's paid you and every thing to run his business and he's ran straight and honest books. I don't see why putting the tax rate back to where it was is going to change his life style so drastically.
The Republicans gave that limited time tax cut. Why would it put him out of business if his taxes was raised back to the original 2% more.
If you have read any of my post and really took it of what I have said, I HAVE NOTHING AGAINST A PERSON WHO DID IT HIMSELF, GETTING RICH. Ross Perot, Bill Lear and Henry Ford before he began thinking he was god.
But the people like the 6 guys from Ford, splitting $6 million dollars of Ford stockholders money, the top leaches of the big banks and stock market making billions of dollars with fraud. Now I think that's unfair and unjust. I hate the Super Rich Predatory Capitalist bastards, let me say again, I HATE THE SUPER RICH "PREDATORY" CAPITALIST BASTARDS, Sorry!
When are you going to get it through your head that profit is the name of the game for all businesses large or small and if the government takes almost half of that profit that isn't right. Why should they pay out the wazoo for benefits and wages and then give half the profit to the government? And so what if their CEO's make tons of money are you jealous? Do you want a share of their money too? They have a lot of responsibility on their heads and have to answer to a lot of people and maybe you'd feel differently if you were a CEO of a large company and think you deserved all that money. Not once have I seen anyone say anything about what these super rich predatory companies do as far as charities and what they give back to communities where they're located. Not once have I seen you mention the fact that Wal-Mart gives free of discounted drugs to those who can't afford them. I am soooo sick of hearing about the "rich predatory capitalists" I could puke.
Quote from: me on August 16, 2010, 10:43:39 AM
It was not a sales business and it's none of your business what it was. Also it was successful I just couldn't get decent help which used to be a problem for most everyone.
I used to be a surgeon but it's none of your business what kind of surgeon I was. I was successful but couldn't get decent OR nurses. The internet is fun; we can all be whomever we want!
Oh, good, then I want to be 30 and a lawyer. :)
Who does everyone else want to be? :biggrin:
Quote from: me on August 16, 2010, 11:00:43 AM
When are you going to get it through your head that profit is the name of the game for all businesses large or small and if the government takes almost half of that profit that isn't right. Why should they pay out the wazoo for benefits and wages and then give half the profit to the government? And so what if their CEO's make tons of money are you jealous? Do you want a share of their money too? They have a lot of responsibility on their heads and have to answer to a lot of people and maybe you'd feel differently if you were a CEO of a large company and think you deserved all that money. Not once have I seen anyone say anything about what these super rich predatory companies do as far as charities and what they give back to communities where they're located. Not once have I seen you mention the fact that Wal-Mart gives free of discounted drugs to those who can't afford them. I am soooo sick of hearing about the "rich predatory capitalists" I could puke.
Why does Walmart gives free of discounted drugs to poor people? It's to get more poor people into their stores so the can sell more cheap foreign shit. Which will do away with more American jobs which will make more poor people to buy more foreign shit from Walmart. That's why.
I thought it was to get more people to use their pharmacy, kinda like Kroger and Target does.
Quote from: Anne on August 16, 2010, 01:10:35 PM
I thought it was to get more people to use their pharmacy, kinda like Kroger and Target does.
[/quote
Just where is the pharmacy at Walmart? It's inside the store where they sell cheap foreign shit. Walmart isn't giving anything away, just for their health and just good will.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on August 16, 2010, 07:36:07 AM
and what in the hell is WRONG if he did?.........HE is the one who built a company from scratch...it is HIS money that is being reinvested, so that WE can have jobs....WTF is the manner with YOU guys?
and for the record, he does NOT live in a million dollar home.....he has a very nice home, with some very nice vehicles, and I am very sure he has money that if he wanted to, he could sell the business and live very comfortable for the rest of his life...NOT everyone who has money are pricks....
Troll, if it was up to YOU, you would demand that this guy give UP a few of his cars, and MORE of HIS money so that YOU can buy one or two of those cars and live in a nicer home....
I do consider myself very fortunate to have such a boss......and I WANT him to continue to be successful, because when HE is successful, I am successful...
Come on Hawk, let's be truthful. No beating around the bush, no spin, no bull shit. Don't you really think that you need a little raise in the pay check. For all of the good work and loyalty you have given him over the year. Just a little money. Not enough for him to lose one of those fine cars. Or not take as many super fine vacations he and his family take. Well, maybe stop him from buying those $30 bottles of wine and go to something that has a screw on cap.
Oh no, I forgot that Obama is coming for his company and Obama is going to break him and make him loose everything he has work so hard for. Hawk, maybe you should ask him for a wage cut.
My God Hawk, that's it, you got to ask for a wage cut If the Republicans let the tax cuts for small business go through and your wage cut, hell he might be able to buy an other car or a cabin on the lake. :biggrin:
Quote from: The Troll on August 16, 2010, 02:27:58 PM
Come on Hawk, let's be truthful. No beating around the bush, no spin, no bull shit. Don't you really think that you need a little raise in the pay check. For all of the good work and loyalty you have given him over the year. Just a little money. Not enough for him to lose one of those fine cars. Or not take as many super fine vacations he and his family take. Well, maybe stop him from buying those $30 bottles of wine and go to something that has a screw on cap.
I have not had a raise in two years, and I have NO problem with that what-so-ever.....I have my job, and he has NOT layed off anyone in our office....when things was going good a few years ago, he was very generous with raises and bonus'....and when things get tight, we shoud expect less......and I WOULD take a pay cut IF it meant me keeping my job....but, I don't think it will come to that.
IF, more owners and employees had this type of relationship....we would NOT be in the situtation that we have today.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on August 16, 2010, 02:51:13 PM
IF, more owners and employees had this type of relationship....we would NOT be in the situation that we have today.
What do you know, after all of the disagreements we have had. We found one thing we can agree on.
If the the employers had treated their employees fairly and honestly, there would never had been a union. Or the predatory environment we have to day.
WOW, let me write this down, put in my book. The Hawk and the Troll agree on one thing.
Quote from: The Troll on August 16, 2010, 03:08:46 PM
What do you know, after all of the disagreements we have had. We found one thing we can agree on.
If the the employers had treated their employees fairly and honestly, there would never had been a union. Or the predatory environment we have to day.
. . .
I agree as well. However to that I would add that states with an "at will" status do nothing to nurture this type of relationship. This status weighs heavily in favor of the employer and as a result the employers abuse it and erode any level of trust and caring the employees may harbor.
Quote from: The Troll on August 16, 2010, 03:08:46 PM
What do you know, after all of the disagreements we have had. We found one thing we can agree on.
If the the employers had treated their employees fairly and honestly, there would never had been a union. Or the predatory environment we have to day.
WOW, let me write this down, put in my book. The Hawk and the Troll agree on one thing.
and I have said so since we started conversing.....and can you also agree that the Union just MIGHT have went too far with some of their demands?
Quote from: Exterminator on August 16, 2010, 12:36:05 PM
I used to be a surgeon but it's none of your business what kind of surgeon I was. I was successful but couldn't get decent OR nurses. The internet is fun; we can all be whomever we want!
You're very funny Ex. Tell us, what do you do for a living and how much do you make? Want to lay it all out here on a public forum? How about giving us your address while you're at it.
Quote from: me on August 16, 2010, 03:37:50 PM
You're very funny Ex. Tell us, what do you do for a living and how much do you make? Want to lay it all out here on a public forum? How about giving us your address while you're at it.
You go first!
You're asking for current information which is different than a business which no longer exists.
Quote from: Sandy Eggo on August 16, 2010, 04:14:49 PM
You're asking for current information which is different than a business which no longer exists.
Sorry but it's still personal info I chose not to reveal.
Quote from: me on August 16, 2010, 05:45:55 PM
Sorry but it's still personal info I chose not to reveal.
Why not? You expect it from the POTUS!
Quote from: Palehorse on August 16, 2010, 03:12:07 PM
I agree as well. However to that I would add that states with an "at will" status do nothing to nurture this type of relationship. This status weighs heavily in favor of the employer and as a result the employers abuse it and erode any level of trust and caring the employees may harbor.
I sure agree with you on the "at will" status, it is sure abused so many many time. It's just the like the "Right to Work Laws" really means the right to work for less. And the Indiana Republican Party sure crammed that down the Indiana workers throat.
No there will never be peace between the workers and the rich owners. Greed will always prevail.
As is the pharmacy at Target and Kroger.
Quote from: Anne on August 16, 2010, 08:22:46 PM
As is the pharmacy at Target and Kroger.
But not all put out free drugs. I wonder what you have to do and prove to get a discount and maybe free drugs. Take a mortgaged out on their souls.
Quote from: Palehorse on August 16, 2010, 06:24:50 PM
Why not? You expect it from the POTUS!
Apples and Oranges. Me is not a public figure, President Obama is.
Quote from: me on August 16, 2010, 05:45:55 PM
Sorry but it's still personal info I chose not to reveal.
I'll tell you what I use to make and the hours I put in and the taxes I paid, I still got my books and some of my check stubs. What did you do cheat on your income taxes? :biggrin: :yes: I bet you did, that's why everything is secret. :rotfl: :rotfl: :yes:
Quote from: The Troll on August 16, 2010, 10:26:51 PM
I'll tell you what I use to make and the hours I put in and the taxes I paid, I still got my books and some of my check stubs. What did you do cheat on your income taxes? :biggrin: :yes: I bet you did, that's why everything is secret. :rotfl: :rotfl: :yes:
Then tell away if you chose to do so on a public forum that is your choice. Just because I happen to want to keep part of my private life just that does in no way mean I cheated at anything it just means I chose to keep it private and no amount of accusations or smart remarks is going to get me to post it.
Quote from: me on August 16, 2010, 10:33:22 PM
Then tell away if you chose to do so on a public forum that is your choice. Just because I happen to want to keep part of my private life just that does in no way mean I cheated at anything it just means I chose to keep it private and no amount of accusations or smart remarks is going to get me to post it.
That the big diffenence between you and me, "Me".. You see I don't care how you feel about me and I really care what other people feel about me. But I do pratice the Golden Rule. Which I have found most Republicans don't pratice.
Quote from: The Troll on August 16, 2010, 11:44:13 PM
That the big diffenence between you and me, "Me".. You see I don't care how you feel about me and I really care what other people feel about me. But I do pratice the Golden Rule. Which I have found most Republicans don't pratice.
And that has what to do with anything about the conversation?
Quote from: me on August 17, 2010, 02:36:37 AM
And that has what to do with anything about the conversation?
You alway want to get in to someone face and when they say put up, you shut up with, "It's none of your business". :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
Quote from: The Troll on August 16, 2010, 09:25:18 PM
But not all put out free drugs. I wonder what you have to do and prove to get a discount and maybe free drugs. Take a mortgaged out on their souls.
Target and Kroger have discounted drugs just like Walmart and Miejers has free antibiotice, and discounted drugs. As far as I know there is no restriction on who can get them except you need a prescription. I have gotten discounted drugs from Walmart without any questions.
Quote from: Anne on August 17, 2010, 05:23:30 PM
Target and Kroger have discounted drugs just like Walmart and Miejers has free antibiotice, and discounted drugs. As far as I know there is no restriction on who can get them except you need a prescription. I have gotten discounted drugs from Walmart without any questions.
Yeah, their good Christain people and just want to get in good with God. Somebody say Amen! Let's :pray:
Nope, it is just good business practice.
Quote from: Anne on August 18, 2010, 11:17:42 PM
Nope, it is just good business practice.
Guess it's time to start putting down people and businesses who try to help people now huh..... :rolleyes: <referring to Troll's post>
Quote from: me on August 18, 2010, 11:23:04 PM
Guess it's time to start putting down people and businesses who try to help people now huh..... :rolleyes: <referring to Troll's post>
Good God, what air heads. If you put "ME" and Anne heads together you would have a air tunnel.
It's an advertising gimmick. I am sure glad something in advertising is helping people. But it sure wasn't a planned charity gimmick. I am quite sure if Walmart had knew what it would have become, they would have never started it.
Quote from: The Troll on August 19, 2010, 08:50:29 AM
Good God, what air heads. If you put "ME" and Anne heads together you would have a air tunnel.
It's an advertising gimmick. I am sure glad something in advertising is helping people. But it sure wasn't a planned charity gimmick. I am quite sure if Walmart had knew what it would have become, they would have never started it.
How could they not have known? Isn't it possible they just wanted to help people? Why does there always have to be an ulterior with you? Now if they were unionized you'd be singing a different tune....it would be, "oh the union is great and Wally World is great and the union is responsible for them giving the free drugs." :rolleyes:
Quote from: me on August 19, 2010, 10:15:12 AM
How could they not have known? Isn't it possible they just wanted to help people? Why does there always have to be an ulterior with you? Now if they were unionized you'd be singing a different tune....it would be, "oh the union is great and Wally World is great and the union is responsible for them giving the free drugs." :rolleyes:
Come on, Baby Cakes. Even you, one of the hard heartest Republican I know. You see I don't think you totally a dumbass. You know Corporations just don't work that way. The least amount of goods and material, for the least amount of expense. Means the most profit. It always been that way since corporations began to be and it sure to hell hasn't change since George W.
As far a the union, I can not believe any one could deny the right of the employees of the LARGEST CORPORATION IN AMERICA to join together as a bargaining unit for themselves.
If you worked for Walmart as an hourly worker and a union came in while you were there. I bet you would be one hell of a good committeewoman in fighting for your people's rights. The would be none of Walmart's bullshit with you. Because you sure can put up one hell of a fight, even when you're wrong. You surely don't believe that corporations should have total control of their employees lives and libertys.
I got to say one thing, if I was in battle with you and we were in a foxhole, I'd give you a machinegun and all of the ammunition it could fire. If we didn't come out a live, there would sure be a pile of dead enemy bodies in front of our hole. :kiss:
Quote from: The Troll on August 19, 2010, 11:14:46 AM
Come on, Baby Cakes. Even you, one of the hard heartest Republican I know. You see I don't think you totally a dumbass. You know Corporations just don't work that way. The least amount of goods and material, for the least amount of expense. Means the most profit. It always been that way since corporations began to be and it sure to hell hasn't change since George W.
As far a the union, I can not believe any one could deny the right of the employees of the LARGEST CORPORATION IN AMERICA to join together as a bargaining unit for themselves.
If you worked for Walmart as an hourly worker and a union came in while you were there. I bet you would be one hell of a good committeewoman in fighting for your people's rights. The would be none of Walmart's bullshit with you. Because you sure can put up one hell of a fight, even when you're wrong. You surely don't believe that corporations should have total control of their employees lives and libertys.
I got to say one thing, if I was in battle with you and we were in a foxhole, I'd give you a machinegun and all of the ammunition it could fire. If we didn't come out a live, there would sure be a pile of dead enemy bodies in front of our hole. :kiss:
If they were a threat to my family you'd better believe it. Won't go into detail but I scared myself one time when I realized I would have ran some people down who were spread across the highway in a threatening manner and I had my daughter who was around 6 at the time and my nephew who was around the same age in the car. They scattered when I down shifted into 4th and gunned the engine. I didn't even think twice about it just did it on instinct. :eek:
I'd say you weren't the only one that you scared. :biggrin:
Quote from: Sandy Eggo on August 19, 2010, 03:27:19 PM
I'd say you weren't the only one that you scared. :biggrin:
The look on their faces was priceless. :biggrin: