There Are Reasonable Republicans

[Exterminator]

Most of them, really.  It's easy to forget that when all we have on this forum are blathering fools with no understand of how anything works who are spoon-fed the crap they parrot by Faux News.

Wake up GOP: Smashing system doesn't fix it

I'm a Republican. Always have been. I believe in free markets, low taxes, reasonable regulation and limited government. But as I look back at the weeks of rancor leading up to Sunday night's last-minute budget deal, I see some things I don't believe in:

Forcing the United States to the verge of default.

Shrugging off the needs and concerns of millions of unemployed.

Protecting every single loophole, giveaway and boondoggle in the tax code as a matter of fundamental conservative principle.

Massive government budget cuts in the midst of the worst recession since World War II.

I am not alone.

Only about one-third of Republicans agree that cutting government spending should be the country's top priority. Only about one-quarter of Republicans insist the budget be balanced without any tax increases.

Yet that one-third and that one-quarter have come to dominate my party. That one-third and that one-quarter forced a debt standoff that could have ended in default and a second Great Recession. That one-third and that one-quarter have effectively written the "no new taxes pledge" into national law.

There was another way. There still is.

Give me a hammer and a church-house door, and I'd post these theses for modern Republicans:

1) Unemployment is a more urgent problem than debt.

The U.S. can borrow money for 10 years at less than 3%. It can borrow money for two years at less than one-half a percent. Yes, the burden of debt is worrying. Yet lenders seem undaunted by those worries.

Meanwhile, more than 14 million Americans are out of work, more than 6 million for longer than six months. The United States has not seen so many people out of work for so long since the 1930s.

2) The deficit is a symptom of America's economic problems, not a cause.

When the economy slumps, government revenues decline and government spending surges.

Federal revenues have collapsed since 2007, down from more than 18% of national income to a little more than 14%. To put that in perspective: That's the equivalent of losing enough revenue to support the entire defense budget.

Federal spending has jumped to pay for unemployment insurance, food stamps and Medicaid benefits.

Fix the economy first, and the deficit will improve on its own.

Cut the deficit first, and the economy will get even sicker.

3) The time to cut is after the economy recovers.

Businesses are hoarding cash. Consumers are repaying debt. State and local governments are slashing jobs. (Since 2009, the number of Americans working for government has shrunk by half a million, the biggest reduction in civilian government employment since the Great Depression.) Right now, there's only one big customer out there: the federal government. How does it help anybody if the feds suddenly stop buying things and paying people?

4) The place to cut is health care, not assistance to the unemployed and poor.

The United States provides less assistance to the unemployed and the poor than almost any other democracy. It spends 60% more per person on health care than almost any other democracy -- and gets worse results. The problem is not that Americans use too much medicine. People in other countries use more. The problem is that Americans pay too much for the medicine they use. Go where the money is, cut where the waste is grossest.

5) We can collect more revenue without raising tax rates.

Republicans stand for low taxes to encourage people to work, save and invest. But how would it discourage work if we reduced the mortgage-interest deduction again? Did it hurt the economy when we reduced the maximum eligible loan to $1 million back in 1986? Do Canadians and Brits -- who lack the deduction -- work less hard than Americans?

Why are state and local taxes deductible from federally taxable income? Wouldn't higher taxes on energy encourage conservation? Who decided to allow inflation to corrode federal alcohol taxes by 80% over the past 50 years?

6) Passion does not substitute for judgment.

Republicans and conservatives have worked themselves into a frenzy of rage and contempt for President Barack Obama. House Speaker John Boehner's post-deal PowerPoint for Republican House members was actually labeled "Two Step Approach to Hold President Obama Accountable" (PDF) -- as if the supreme goal of policy in this time of economic hardship were to fix the blame for all problems on the president. This exercise in finger-pointing satisfies the emotions of the Republican base. It does not accurately explain the causes of the crisis or offer plausible remedies.

7) You can't save the system by destroying the system.

In their passion, Republicans convinced themselves that the constitutional republic and the free-enterprise system were threatened as never before. Their response? To threaten to blow up the free-enterprise system and wreck the republic unless they gained their point.

Republicans have become so gripped by pessimism and panic that they feel they have nothing to lose by rushing into a catastrophe now. But there is a lot to lose, and in these past weeks America nearly lost it. Let's hope that as America steps back from the brink, Republicans remember that it's their job to protect the system, not to smash the system in hopes of building something better from the ruins.

That's how student radicals think -- not conservatives.

[Exterminator]

Here's another one; Boone County Councilman At-Large, David Rogers:

"AN OPEN LETTER TO MY FELLOW CONSERVATIVES

I'm frustrated, too. Both major parties are to blame for the fiscal mess in Washington, but I'm particularly disappointed that the Republican Party – which I've supported my entire adult life as the party of limited government, fiscal discipline and local control – oversaw much of the past decade's debt explosion. I understand why many of you have been so disgusted that you've turned to the Tea Party 'movement.' I don't always agree with their arguments or their actions, but that's how democratic society works: concerned citizens engage each other on issues that matter, even when they disagree.

However, I cannot sit quietly by as our local Tea Party, like far too many other 'conservative' groups and individuals, goes beyond political debate to inciting violence and advocating treason. The group's booth at this year's Boone County Fair proudly displayed and offered for sale t-shirts that proclaim 'Got Ammo!' Such a threat – and it is clearly a threat – has no place in political debate, nor in civilized society. Tea Party supporters tell me they expect a civil war if the federal government does not return to what they consider 'constitutional' principles, and they want to be ready. Advocating this position is advocating treason. It threatens violence to those who disagree and endorses armed resistance to government. Another big seller encourages violence by stating 'Our forefathers would be shooting by now.' Tea Partiers claim to advocate 'Liberty, not Tyranny;' the only forefathers who might call our government today 'tyranny' are the fathers of the Confederacy, who claimed to fight for liberty while committing treason to protect slavery. The patriots of the Boston Tea Party petitioned their government and carried out peaceful protest, only resorting to violence when, in response to that protest, the Crown took away their rights to self-government by closing their courts and outlawing their democratic assemblies. Our forefathers took up arms to defend those rights, rights we enjoy today to an extent none of them could even have imagined.

Losing an election is not tyranny; it's democracy. Compromise is not treason; it's governance. Living in a diverse society with people whose views differ so dramatically is difficult. Freedom requires behaving responsibly, and remembering that our words have consequences. Violent and threatening rhetoric has no place in our political discourse. I want no part of it, nor of any group which condones it. We're better than this."

[Exterminator]

It's very telling that our resident know-it-all neocons are avoiding this subject like the plague.

[The Troll]

SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSILENCE!

  Where is the smart remarks about Socialism, Freedom, Happiness.  How the rich shall inherit the earth instead of the meek.  How the lion will eat the lamb.  Cricket, cricket, cricket.

  All the bull shit of getting jobs for the people and nothing about the 163,000 factories, plants and business that left the country and out sourced jobs.  Tearing down these buildings, taking their machines, their USA patents, secrets and manufacturing processes to foreign countries.

  Nothing about China charging 36% tarriff on our products and we charge them only 3%.  Just where fairness in these free trade treaties.  JUST WHERE IN HELL ARE THE GREAT MINDS.  IT SURE WASN'T IN THE MINDS OF THE REPUBLICANS WHO MADE THEM.


                                                                       

[The Troll]

  Where the jobs Boner and Turtle head?  I heard Boehner and McConnell say they were going to produce some jobs.

  I know where they could create 70,000 jobs.  Come back to Washington and get the FAA budget signed.  What assholes.  Is there anything the Republican/Tea Party do to screw up this country.  The turds of the world.   

[me]

Why respond when all yer doin' is talkin' stupid shit.  You two have a nice conversation, or should I say bash fest.   

[Palehorse]

The thing that gets me about the "debt ceiling" legislation these idiots passed, is that it is nothing short of a ticking time bomb! If anyone in this country expects this pack of jackyls to come to an agreement before the first "deadline", on anything, they seriously need to seek professional help.

And I predict the conservatives will hold that fact over their heads in order to force their ludicrous agenda on the people of this country; and absent any movement toward such they'll stall their way to the automatic across the boards cuts that will virtually kill the poorest amongst the population, and blame it on the POTUS! 

[The Troll]

Why respond when all yer doin' is talkin' stupid shit.  You two have a nice conversation, or should I say bash fest.

  "ME" we are interested in what you have to say, if it made sense.  I can't see how you can sit where you are at you computer and say that that has happened to this country is Obama's fault.

  The Republican fair trade treaties.  NAFTA, WTO and so many other bad ones.  The outsourcing of 163,000 corporations, business, their machines used to make products, their patents, and their research and secrets outsourced and left their building in disrepair and falling down and let the taxpayers tear them down.  Plus they received tax cuts for doing it under the Republican Party and your wonderful brainy George W. Bush.  Eight long, long years of George W. Bush.  To top it off you voted for him two times.

  How can you honestly defend, Sarah Palin and Michell Bachman and say they are intelligent to be president of the United States of America.

  Yes, we would listen to you if you made sense.  I think it time for you to open you mind a little and see what is really going on.  It's not what you think it is.

We spent billions and billions of dollars and thousands of American children, our young soldiers fighting Communism and how who is our banker, who's buying our companies and taking they back home, who killing our workers by taking their jobs, flooding our country with cheap trash, sold by your wonderful Walmart.  Who is it. Communist Republic of China.  This is one war they are winning and you can't see it.   

[me]

But Troll, to me you make no sense.  How can we continue all these government hand outs and not get deeper into debt?  This budget thing should have been done 2yrs ago and then last year ya'll keep forgetting that little gem.  Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid are as much to blame as anyone in this mess and Obama really needs to get them under control.  The economy is getting worse by the day and it no longer has anything to do with what Bush did, this is Obama's baby now and it isn't getting any better.  Have you been to the grocery store lately? 

[Exterminator]

Why respond when all yer doin' is talkin' stupid shit.  You two have a nice conversation, or should I say bash fest.

Your only redeeming quality is that you're old and soon won't be taking up precious oxygen that others need to live.

[The Troll]

But Troll, to me you make no sense.  How can we continue all these government hand outs and not get deeper into debt?  This budget thing should have been done 2yrs ago and then last year ya'll keep forgetting that little gem.  Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid are as much to blame as anyone in this mess and Obama really needs to get them under control.  The economy is getting worse by the day and it no longer has anything to do with what Bush did, this is Obama's baby now and it isn't getting any better.  Have you been to the grocery store lately?

  With you it's the same pig headed response.  It's Obama's fault and Pelosi and Reid fault.  Pelosi and Reid has only one vote.  It takes the vote from two houses to pass a bill.  So you can cut that lie.

  All of your ideas are warped and out of touch.  Your little boy George W. did this and it's going to take a long, long time to cure all of his cluster fucks ups.

  Me and my wife shop every week together and I see every price and total cost.  How's that's Obama's fault.  I sick of you "ME" and all of your lies.

 

[me]

  With you it's the same pig headed response.  It's Obama's fault and Pelosi and Reid fault.  Pelosi and Reid has only one vote.  It takes the vote from two houses to pass a bill.  So you can cut that lie.

  All of your ideas are warped and out of touch.  Your little boy George W. did this and it's going to take a long, long time to cure all of his cluster fucks ups.

  Me and my wife shop every week together and I see every price and total cost.  How's that's Obama's fault.  I sick of you "ME" and all of your lies.

Pelosi didn't even try to work out a budget when she was speaker so don't hand me that crap.  There was nothing done period except her pet projects.

[The Troll]

Pelosi didn't even try to work out a budget when she was speaker so don't hand me that crap.  There was nothing done period except her pet projects.

  I don't even want to talk to you about nothing other than some cooking or plumbing.  You're just plain nuts on everything else.

[Y]

Ex,

The unfortunate part is that what now passes for the Republican Party bears little to no resemblance to the party who would have Teddy Roosevelt, Nelson Rockefeller, or George Romney as members.

The current form of the Republican party strives to see just how authoritarian, reactionary, theocratic, and servile to Capital it can be.

[me]

Ex,

The unfortunate part is that what now passes for the Republican Party bears little to no resemblance to the party who would have Teddy Roosevelt, Nelson Rockefeller, or George Romney as members.

The current form of the Republican party strives to see just how authoritarian, reactionary, theocratic, and servile to Capital it can be.

And who is it who is trying to put a thumb on opposing opinions by shutting down TV stations and radio broadcasts and demonizing anyone who happened to have a differing opinion?  Who keeps saying "if you don't agree with the President you're a racist?  And while were at it what was with that comment Obama made about he'd rather Congress was on vacation because the last thing he needed was them in Washington fighting because he could take care of things?  Hum.