Arizona's new illigal ilien law. Good or Bad?

[The Troll]

Oh don't get your panties in a wad! You can dish it out but you can't take it can you? Cripes.

And as usual the relevant and finer points of the argument go right over your head, but that's okay.

I'll let you assume what you will surrounding my marksmanship and abilities, as delusional as they may be. I'll just state that you're doing a fine job at waving Maggie's Drawers  though. . .

My points are valid none the less; and clearly this country never learns from its mistakes.

  What do you mean I can dish it out?  It seem at first all I stated is, get and keep out the illegal people that are invading this country.  I don't care what color or race.  Come in legally.

  My people were Amish and Mennonite.  My people weren't here when your people were working for King George and killing our first colonists.  If  you like that as part of  your history, an eagle feather in you bonnet, wear it proudly.  I worked with two Germen's who fought against us in WWII.  Fine men, they were fighting for their country.

  But here is one of your sentences that went "over my head" and I can't seen to under stand what it means. --- "I'll let you assume  you will surrounding my markmanship and abilities, as delusional as they maybe."----- Since I am not afraid of dying for the right reason.  In combat one on one my skills are just as good or better than  yours.  Just the straight facts.

   It's not that I'm waving Maggie's drawers, It just seem that your fuse was getting a little short.  It was better to end that subject before it became worse.  Especially when there is someone that agrees with me so much on "The Twins" and the Democratic Party and International Corporations screwing up our country and our Gulf.  Friends? 

The Troll  

   

[Henry Hawk]

you guys are making this WAY too complicating..............we have a law where is states you must go through proper porcedures to enter this country..........and there are those who are NOT doing so.  We need to find these folks and handle them accordingly.  It it THAT simple.

[me]

You are not, you have to go too. 

But, but, but, couldn't I be grandfathered in since I've been here so long?   

[followsthewolf]

You mean you're a male?

[Henry Hawk]

You mean you're a male?

grandmothered?... ....ftw, you crack me up...

[me]

You mean you're a male?

Er, uh, that was figuratively speaking......

[Palehorse]

  What do you mean I can dish it out?  It seem at first all I stated is, get and keep out the illegal people that are invading this country.  I don't care what color or race.  Come in legally.

And I am saying if you want to take that approach that includes you. If a child born in this country is NOT a citizen then that includes most of the people presently alive in this country, except for Native Americans. The law didn't change since it was written.

  My people were Amish and Mennonite.  My people weren't here when your people were working for King George and killing our first colonists.  If  you like that as part of  your history, an eagle feather in you bonnet, wear it proudly.  I worked with two Germen's who fought against us in WWII.  Fine men, they were fighting for their country.

Great, then you guys can go back to Germany or where ever else it is you came from.

Clearly you've bought into the white mans perceptions of Native Americans, which is 180 degrees from the reality. Do you really think eagle feathers represent the killing of the white man or other human beings?

  But here is one of your sentences that went "over my head" and I can't seen to under stand what it means. --- "I'll let you assume  you will surrounding my markmanship and abilities, as delusional as they maybe."----- Since I am not afraid of dying for the right reason.  In combat one on one my skills are just as good or better than  yours.  Just the straight facts.

My statement points out the fact that you know nothing about me, and due to this you are making some assumptions. For all you know I could be a spec ops trained sniper, or something else. . . Making such assumptions is a key mistake made by those who would seek to inflict harm upon those they oppose.

   It's not that I'm waving Maggie's drawers, It just seem that your fuse was getting a little short.  It was better to end that subject before it became worse.  Especially when there is someone that agrees with me so much on "The Twins" and the Democratic Party and International Corporations screwing up our country and our Gulf.  Friends? 

The Troll  

It is not my fuse that is lit or short. You are the one who made a statement surrounding my tribe, and a veiled inquiry, and when I pointed you in the direction to find the answers if you really wanted them, you went nuclear. Not me.

Moreover, you are the one making derogatory statements surrounding Native Americans, and perpetuating the Hollywood propaganda surrounding them. That is akin to any other racial epitaph you might sling toward any person of color. Yet it isn't me who was offended, but you.

I never said we weren't friends, nor did I ever say we agree on everything. Just most things. This is not one of them.

[Sandy Eggo]

Henry, that's the point. We have Federal laws in place for this issue which may need overhauled or perhaps just enforced. Arizona's law is threatening the constitutional rights of American citizens.

It's against the law to hire illegal aliens, but yet, people do it. Find out why they're not afraid to break that law and tighten it so that they are. Cut off the water and the stream goes dry.

Also, the need to take another look at the procedures to become a citizen. Are they clear?complicated? expensive?

What about work and education visas for those that want a better life, but don't want to give up citizenship to their own country. They exist, so why are people willing to risk getting caught rather than get one? Again, too complicated? expensive? Someone needs to find out.

One last thing. Do you know how people are treated who seek asylum here? I do, and I'd risk getting caught before I'd go through the process. That needs to be looked at.

Profiling is not the answer. Some of these people look like you and I. I don't carry my license everywhere. With a law like Arizona's could I be locked up or worse for suspicion?

[Palehorse]

Man, you are GOOD!

That right there just about says it all!

Sad too isn't it?!

[Henry Hawk]

Henry, that's the point. We have Federal laws in place for this issue which may need overhauled or perhaps just enforced. Arizona's law is threatening the constitutional rights of American citizens.

It's against the law to hire illegal aliens, but yet, people do it. Find out why they're not afraid to break that law and tighten it so that they are. Cut off the water and the stream goes dry.

Also, the need to take another look at the procedures to become a citizen. Are they clear?complicated? expensive?

What about work and education visas for those that want a better life, but don't want to give up citizenship to their own country. They exist, so why are people willing to risk getting caught rather than get one? Again, too complicated? expensive? Someone needs to find out.

One last thing. Do you know how people are treated who seek asylum here? I do, and I'd risk getting caught before I'd go through the process. That needs to be looked at.

Profiling is not the answer. Some of these people look like you and I. I don't carry my license everywhere. With a law like Arizona's could I be locked up or worse for suspicion?

Sandy, I agree with everything you just said.....and the AZ law does NOTHING to violate that....you cannot profile.  It clearly says that.  It does say THAT IF a person is being questioned for suspesion of a crime, the authorities have the right to check with immigration to see if they are legal....and you are supposed to carry a license with you when you drive....if you don't you CAN go to jail.....so, if you are here with a green card, then carry it with you....it is really pretty simple.

as far as everything else you stated I agree with..the procedures to become a citizen...I think they need to be redone....have an area like ellis island was back a hundred years ago, a place to process immigrants, do a check on them, and a simplier process to become a citizen...work visa's are fine too IF that is what each state wants....I think we need to fine the crap out of companies who hire workers without proper documentation...

all of these need to be done, but ridding out those who are here NOW, Illegally, need to be removed.

[Sandy Eggo]

Henry, you need to go back and read the link I posted.

[Anne]

Where would you go, except maybe swimming or next door without your id?

[Sandy Eggo]

Everywhere, I rarely carry it unless I'm driving. Living in an area with lots of public transpotation, I rarely even drive. I do carry it if I'm planning to shop and I don't have cash. Otherwise I don't need it unless someome mistakes me for an illegal alien.

[Henry Hawk]

Otherwise I don't need it unless someome mistakes me for an illegal alien.

bingo!!

[Sandy Eggo]

Bingo? Really? So, I don't have my ID on me and someone mistakes me for an illegal alien. I live here! This is my country, but I get roughed up and thrown in jail. How is that not a violation of my rights?