News:

This year - 2026 - is the Unknown Zone's 25th anniversary!

Come join in the festivities!

Main Menu

Nazi brown shirts again?

Started by Gardengirl, March 19, 2009, 10:58:28 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Print
Go Down Pages 1 ... 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19
User actions

mcgonser

#225
March 30, 2009, 11:15:22 PM
God gave is free will: You want to blame all the evil and sin on God, it is man that chooses to do this. It is mans nature do wrong. Blame the real culprit, man, not God. Because of free will he does not interfer and make us be good. He could but he doesn't, think about it.
Thats my story and I'm sticking to it!

Exterminator

#226
March 31, 2009, 07:41:37 AM
Quote from: Henry Hawk on March 30, 2009, 04:42:09 PM
the vast majority of them DID...period. those are facts........55 signers were members of various Christian denominations...maybe I cannot prove they ALL cherished the Bible, but there are quotes from many, that strongly insinuate this.

55 signers of what?  Want to hit us with some more "facts"?  Any idea how many of those who were affiliated with a Christian denomination ultimately didn't turn out to follow that religion at all?  Do you know what Unitatrianism is?  What a Freemason is?
Arguing with Christians is like playing chess with a pigeon.  No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, shit on the board and strut around like it's victorious.

The truth is slow, but relentless. Over time it becomes irresistible.

Exterminator

#227
March 31, 2009, 07:44:20 AM
Quote from: mcgonser on March 30, 2009, 11:15:22 PM
God gave is free will: You want to blame all the evil and sin on God, it is man that chooses to do this. It is mans nature do wrong. Blame the real culprit, man, not God. Because of free will he does not interfer and make us be good. He could but he doesn't, think about it.

Either he can't interfere or he won't; if it's the latter, he must not care.
Arguing with Christians is like playing chess with a pigeon.  No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, shit on the board and strut around like it's victorious.

The truth is slow, but relentless. Over time it becomes irresistible.

Henry Hawk

#228
March 31, 2009, 08:33:34 AM
Quote from: Exterminator on March 31, 2009, 07:41:37 AM
55 signers of what?  Want to hit us with some more "facts"?  Any idea how many of those who were affiliated with a Christian denomination ultimately didn't turn out to follow that religion at all?  Do you know what Unitatrianism is?  What a Freemason is?

Okay, virtually every one of the 55 writers and signers of the United States Constitution were members of various Christian denominations...29 were Anglicans, 16 to 18 were Calvinists, 2 were Methodists, 2 were Lutherans, 2 were Roman Catholic, 1 lapsed Quaker and sometimes Anglican, and 1 open deist--Dr. Franklin who attended every kind of Christian worship, called for public prayer, and contributed to all denominations.

Guys, it is very evident, that THESE guys were NOT secular men.........I'm not claiming that these guys intended for everyone to be "religious"....but, the freedom to practice religion would NEVER be jepardized in this country....and I AM claiming these guys had a BELIEF in a higher being....predominatly The God of the Holy Bible.

Why does this bother you so much?
and I'm NOT saying that they intended for all citizens to be believers....they clearly wrote it to protect ALL parties involved...for Government NOT to interfer with religions or stick their nose in it......THAT was the problem they had with the OLD country.

Congress found the Bible so important, it even printed it for the American people back in 1782.

It's also evident that Jefferson wasn't afraid to mix religion and state as you walk the grounds of the University of Virginia in Charlottesville, a college designed by Jefferson himself.

"Faith and works will show their worth by their weight in the scales of eternal justice before God's tribunal."
 Thomas Jefferson

the evidence is enoromous...



"The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left."
Ecclesiastes 10:2 - It all makes sense to me now...


"The future ain't what it used to be."– Yogi Berra

"Square roots are rarely found on any plant." FTW

Henry Hawk

#229
March 31, 2009, 08:54:53 AM
Yes I do know what Unitatrianism is and Freemason is.....though I somewhat disagree with them...they ARE believers in God.
"The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left."
Ecclesiastes 10:2 - It all makes sense to me now...


"The future ain't what it used to be."– Yogi Berra

"Square roots are rarely found on any plant." FTW

Exterminator

#230
March 31, 2009, 09:04:06 AM
Quote from: Henry Hawk on March 31, 2009, 08:33:34 AM
Okay, virtually every one of the 55 writers and signers of the United States Constitution were members of various Christian denominations...29 were Anglicans, 16 to 18 were Calvinists, 2 were Methodists, 2 were Lutherans, 2 were Roman Catholic, 1 lapsed Quaker and sometimes Anglican, and 1 open deist--Dr. Franklin who attended every kind of Christian worship, called for public prayer, and contributed to all denominations.

That's very interesting considering that only 39 people signed the U.S. Constitution.  You must be thinking of the Declaration Of Independence but, of course, 56 men signed it so your number isn't accurate for that either.  So much for your 'facts'.

QuoteGuys, it is very evident, that THESE guys were NOT secular men.........I'm not claiming that these guys intended for everyone to be "religious"....but, the freedom to practice religion would NEVER be jepardized in this country....and I AM claiming these guys had a BELIEF in a higher being....predominatly The God of the Holy Bible.

I don't dispute that but it isn't what started this conversation.  You said, "based upon History and it's writtings, that our forefathers believed in God, the God of Abraham....and the vast majority of them believed inthe Holy Bible...and it WAS the moral compass that they used to design our constitution....," and that is patently false.  The framers of the Constitution went out of their way to leave religion out of it.

QuoteWhy does this bother you so much?

Why does it bother you so much that peoples' sense of fairness and morality is inherent and has nothing to do with belief in any god or book?  Can't people just be decent human beings simply because it's in most of our nature?  Furthermore, how can you give some god credit for all of the good qualities in people and not hold him responsible for the evil?
Arguing with Christians is like playing chess with a pigeon.  No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, shit on the board and strut around like it's victorious.

The truth is slow, but relentless. Over time it becomes irresistible.

Exterminator

#231
March 31, 2009, 09:05:09 AM
Quote from: Henry Hawk on March 31, 2009, 08:54:53 AM
Yes I do know what Unitatrianism is and Freemason is.....though I somewhat disagree with them...they ARE believers in God.

They certainly aren't believers in Jesus or your Bible.
Arguing with Christians is like playing chess with a pigeon.  No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, shit on the board and strut around like it's victorious.

The truth is slow, but relentless. Over time it becomes irresistible.

Exterminator

#232
March 31, 2009, 09:10:17 AM
Quote from: Henry Hawk on March 31, 2009, 08:33:34 AM
It's also evident that Jefferson wasn't afraid to mix religion and state as you walk the grounds of the University of Virginia in Charlottesville, a college designed by Jefferson himself.

"Faith and works will show their worth by their weight in the scales of eternal justice before God's tribunal."
 Thomas Jefferson

the evidence is enoromous...

Uh, Thomas Jefferson was a deist; do you know what that means?
Arguing with Christians is like playing chess with a pigeon.  No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, shit on the board and strut around like it's victorious.

The truth is slow, but relentless. Over time it becomes irresistible.

Henry Hawk

#233
March 31, 2009, 09:22:19 AM
Quote from: Exterminator on March 31, 2009, 09:10:17 AM
Uh, Thomas Jefferson was a deist; do you know what that means?

yes, and big deal...He believed in God...and THAT is my whole point....I'm not saying that ALL of these guys were devout Christians....I AM saying THEY revered God....and believed He played an important role in their decision making while designing our founding documents...
"The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left."
Ecclesiastes 10:2 - It all makes sense to me now...


"The future ain't what it used to be."– Yogi Berra

"Square roots are rarely found on any plant." FTW

mcgonser

#234
March 31, 2009, 09:30:22 AM
HERE WAS BURIED THOMAS JEFFERSON
AUTHOR OF THE DECLARATION OF AMERICAN INDEPENDENCE
OF THE STATUTE OF VIRGINIA FOR RELIGIOUS FREEDOM
AND FATHER OF THE UNIVERSITY OF VIRGINIA

This epitath was written by Jefferson himself.
Thats my story and I'm sticking to it!

Exterminator

#235
March 31, 2009, 09:39:50 AM
Quote from: Henry Hawk on March 31, 2009, 09:22:19 AM
yes, and big deal...He believed in God...and THAT is my whole point....I'm not saying that ALL of these guys were devout Christians....I AM saying THEY revered God....and believed He played an important role in their decision making while designing our founding documents...

You've backpedalled quite a bit from your earlier assertion that the bible was the basis for our founding documents but you're still wrong.  Deists believe that there is a god but they do not believe that he is interested in what happens here on earth or intervenes.  They certainly do not 'revere' him.
Arguing with Christians is like playing chess with a pigeon.  No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, shit on the board and strut around like it's victorious.

The truth is slow, but relentless. Over time it becomes irresistible.

Exterminator

#236
March 31, 2009, 09:40:33 AM
Quote from: mcgonser on March 31, 2009, 09:30:22 AM
HERE WAS BURIED THOMAS JEFFERSON
AUTHOR OF THE DECLARATION OF AMERICAN INDEPENDENCE
OF THE STATUTE OF VIRGINIA FOR RELIGIOUS FREEDOM
AND FATHER OF THE UNIVERSITY OF VIRGINIA

This epitath was written by Jefferson himself.

Your point?
Arguing with Christians is like playing chess with a pigeon.  No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, shit on the board and strut around like it's victorious.

The truth is slow, but relentless. Over time it becomes irresistible.

mcgonser

#237
March 31, 2009, 09:41:10 AM
Ex: Have you read the Jefferson Bible?
Thats my story and I'm sticking to it!

Exterminator

#238
March 31, 2009, 09:44:13 AM
Quote from: mcgonser on March 31, 2009, 09:41:10 AM
Ex: Have you read the Jefferson Bible?

I have not but you understand that that book presents Jesus as a good man but not a god; don't you?
Arguing with Christians is like playing chess with a pigeon.  No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, shit on the board and strut around like it's victorious.

The truth is slow, but relentless. Over time it becomes irresistible.

mcgonser

#239
March 31, 2009, 09:55:43 AM
But you, yourself have not read it? I found it arrogant of any man to take the Bible and write his version of it. By omitting and adding what you think, you change the whole meaning or what God wanted to say to us. He does  tell us to not add or take away from the bible. That is JMO
Thats my story and I'm sticking to it!
Print
Go Up Pages 1 ... 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19
User actions