Why Atheists Are So Angry...

[Sandy Eggo]

I am going to pinch hit for HH if I may be so bold on this one.

Christmas is foremost about Christ and his birthday.

Why? If they don't even know when his birthday was, then why December 25th? "The Roman Catholic Church chose December 25 as the day for the Feast of the Nativity in order to give Christian meaning to existing pagan rituals. "

However, if believing that it's Christ's birthday, gives the day a lil' more meaning for you, HH and countless others, then by all means...carry on.

Over the years this message has been watered down and glossed over until we got acceptance of nativity scenes being booted out of the traditional spots. People are instructed not to say Merry Christmas even because it might offend someone.

Government property, be it city, county, state or federal property should be free of all religious displays. Those agencies serve people of all faiths and should be representative of all faiths or none at all.  Business may be guilty of instructing their employees not to say "Merry Christmas" for much the same reason. Their bottom line comes from many different religious and non-religious backgrounds. Personally, I can see why generic would be better in both of those cases. However, if you, HH and scores of others would like to run through the streets with your Merry Christmas sweaters, screaming Merry Christmas at the tops of your lungs, waving Merry Christmas banners, no one cares. If you're bothered that the message is "watered down" then you say "Merry Christmas".

Then you factor in how commercialized Christmas has become, how it's shoved down our throats to spend barrels of money during the toughest season of the year, and if you don't, then you just didn't have a "good Christmas".

This I agree with, but what isn't commercialized? Keeping up w/the Joneses and all that.

To top it off, there is nothing sacred, there is nothing pure. Christmas gets dumped on by filth, it's hammered with more than it's share of vulgarity and in contrast to those days of yesteryear it's losing its meaning and frankly it's magic.

30, 40 years ago it was special, now.....*sigh*

30, 40 years ago, you were a kid. Everything seems special and magical to kids.

[lex]

The United States Government made Christmas a national holiday. On it we should be celebrating Christmas and all of it's goodies, that includes JESUS, for pity's sake the holiday is named after him. If people don't like it they need to put a sock in it and shut up.

Should we decide to made another religious holiday part of the national holiday then by golly we will let them do it up right as well.

The Congress shall not make any law respecting religion. Respecting means PERTAINING TO. Our founding fathers was saying when it came to anything of religion, the government needs to STFU and mind it's own business.

We are still suffering today from Government influence upon religion today from a horrible mistake of misinterpreting that amendment for our own whims. It was when the Morman church was beset upon by the Federal Government when they were in their own state, within their own laws.

This is when the Feds decided to ignore "shall not make any law pertaining to religion". Now the wording has been twisted, and the heathens are using it to their advantage.

[Henry Hawk]

Wow, you're a lil' testy when faced w/the fallacy of your thinking aren't ya?

Christianity is interconnected w/Christmas throughout history. It's a  holiday seeped in VARIOUS traditions and beliefs and I think you're missing my point. The holiday has been secular all along regardless of it's connection to Christianity.

Why do you perceive the truth about the origin of Christmas to be an attack on your faith? I  haven't said anything negative about Christianity or your personal faith at all.

you have not conceived my point.....I fully understand yours.  I do not think you can understand, I guess it is like when some blacks say it's a "black thing".....we come from different worlds piya, sounds crazy, but my world is recongnizing my Lord first and foremost...period.  I'm not testy at you, I am frustrated how nobody even comes close to understanding 'Christians'.  They always have to go to the Pat Robertson types and use them as a poster child, when the TV evangelist noways come near representing the vast majority of the hard working day to day Christians in the Country, who are sick to death about having to defend EVERYTHING about our religion. 
Schools can have gay/lesbian days and gay awareness day, and that is alrighty.....but, don't even think about having a Christian prayer group meet on school grounds.....Life for Christ groups have been shut down in most public school systems, because the administration is tired of dealing with a small group of idiots who claim thier constitution is being violated...which crap, but it costs the schools money to fight every one of the BS attempts at busting up the word of God.

[Mr442]

At one time, Christmans was illegal in the colonies, as it was at one time in England.  America being the melting pot it is, has adapted many different Christmas traditions, to make it a very American holiday.  Most of those traditions centered around a new year, the renewal of life, and some gift giving.  Americans have been the ones guilty of pushing the religious angle, more than any other culture.

And FWIW, Easter has very pagan (Wiccan I beleive) roots when it comes to rabbits laying colored eggs.  That is another one that makes me laugh due to the irony.  Good Christians out collecting their pagan eggs.  Talk about not practicing what you preach!

[dan foster]

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/DineshDSouza/2007/12/09/why_atheists_are_so_angry

One reason I think is that they are God-haters.

Thanks, but it is hard to hate something that doesn't exist.  Now, the god of the bible is worthy of contempt, as any rational human being can conclude for themselves.  But hate, no.  It is all pretty laughable.  Now, where did you get your strawman that "atheists are angry"?

[dan foster]

You got to think of things on the whole in these matters. We can't ignore spiritual warfare and think this is just a human being thing. As Christians are guided by the Holy Spirit, its only logical the non-believers are guided by the enemy.

Yes, we are guided by the prince of darkness, Darth Vader.  And you wonder how it is you can't possibly be taken seriously by rational human beings.  Again, how is it that you live in a episode of Star Wars, cosmic game of good and evil, and can say such shiite and are suprised when people like me laugh at it.  Thanks for the entertainment factor, however.

[dan foster]

The United States Government made Christmas a national holiday. On it we should be celebrating Christmas and all of it's goodies, that includes JESUS, for pity's sake the holiday is named after him. If people don't like it they need to put a sock in it and shut up.

Should we decide to made another religious holiday part of the national holiday then by golly we will let them do it up right as well.

The Congress shall not make any law respecting religion. Respecting means PERTAINING TO. Our founding fathers was saying when it came to anything of religion, the government needs to STFU and mind it's own business.

We are still suffering today from Government influence upon religion today from a horrible mistake of misinterpreting that amendment for our own whims. It was when the Morman church was beset upon by the Federal Government when they were in their own state, within their own laws.

This is when the Feds decided to ignore "shall not make any law pertaining to religion". Now the wording has been twisted, and the heathens are using it to their advantage.

The gov't has no business sanctioning a religious holiday and just because that mistaken practice, et al,  still exists, doesn't make it right.  No, christmas has become secular, whether you like it or not, and is really just the pagan winter solstice festival it started out as.  You can worship jesus, if you want.  Just don't expect the gov't, or the rest of us to.

[dan foster]

you have not conceived my point.....I fully understand yours.  I do not think you can understand, I guess it is like when some blacks say it's a "black thing".....we come from different worlds piya, sounds crazy, but my world is recongnizing my Lord first and foremost...period.  I'm not testy at you, I am frustrated how nobody even comes close to understanding 'Christians'.  They always have to go to the Pat Robertson types and use them as a poster child, when the TV evangelist noways come near representing the vast majority of the hard working day to day Christians in the Country, who are sick to death about having to defend EVERYTHING about our religion. 
Schools can have gay/lesbian days and gay awareness day, and that is alrighty.....but, don't even think about having a Christian prayer group meet on school grounds.....Life for Christ groups have been shut down in most public school systems, because the administration is tired of dealing with a small group of idiots who claim thier constitution is being violated...which crap, but it costs the schools money to fight every one of the BS attempts at busting up the word of God.

Schools celebrate gay and lesbian days?  Strange.  It would be nice if schools just taught math and science, with some humanities/art thrown in for good measure.  And they sure don't need religion pushed in (other than survey classes in the humanities side) to foul things up.  Religion is a personal choice and not to be promoted by any school.  Take your kids and home school them if you don't want them to get a secular education (aka a meaningful one).

Its the small group of idiots that want school prayer, jesus classes (and AHoles like chunk gonads that want a bible in every classroom) that are messing up the works.  I would be just as resistant to a school board allowing a gay/lesbian day as I would them letting ID in schools or abstinence only idiocy.  So, hank if you are telling the truth (and I really doubt that), what school is celebrating gay and lesbian days?

[Henry Hawk]

Schools celebrate gay and lesbian days?  Strange.  It would be nice if schools just taught math and science, with some humanities/art thrown in for good measure.  And they sure don't need religion pushed in (other than survey classes in the humanities side) to foul things up.  Religion is a personal choice and not to be promoted by any school.  Take your kids and home school them if you don't want them to get a secular education (aka a meaningful one).

Its the small group of idiots that want school prayer, jesus classes (and AHoles like chunk gonads that want a bible in every classroom) that are messing up the works.  I would be just as resistant to a school board allowing a gay/lesbian day as I would them letting ID in schools or abstinence only idiocy.  So, hank if you are telling the truth (and I really doubt that), what school is celebrating gay and lesbian days?

I'm sort of getting tired of you calling me a liar, this is not the first time.....http://www.thebody.com/content/art5942.html

The San Francisco Unified School District (SFUSD) established their Support Services for Gay, Lesbian & Bisexual Youth program because of their belief that "[a]ll students within the SFUSD have a right to an education in a safe and nurturing enviroment. This includes students who are gay, lesbian, bisexual, or those who are questioning their sexuality."

In the St. Paul public schools, the "Out for Equity" program provides voluntary support groups for gay and lesbian students in three schools. The program's materials make quite clear that it is not a part of the curriculum, it is completely voluntary, and there is no recruiting or advocating of homosexuality.

this is just a few from this article, I have read there are thousand of public schools that have special classes set up for gay awareness...

and I'm NOT saying religion should be PUSHED on anybody..........I'm with you 100%, always have been Dan......It IS a personal choice...PERIOD......Please get that through your head..........I, along with most Christians believe that....I'm saying there have been cases where some schools will NOT allow Christian groups to meet on school property after school hours....and I think that is wrong...but, allowing the Gay Values be taught on the Federal Dime.....double standard as far as I'm concerned......

and I sure do agree that we should be back to teaching the 3 R's.....and leave the rest to the parents to teach....

[Henry Hawk]

Thanks, but it is hard to hate something that doesn't exist.  Now, the god of the bible is worthy of contempt, as any rational human being can conclude for themselves.  But hate, no.  It is all pretty laughable.  Now, where did you get your strawman that "atheists are angry"?

you are the best example I have seen of an angry atheist...........................you despise everything our Country stands for as far a its heritage of God and Country.............it is loaded with it, and YOUR leader ( ) Dawkins.....is the angriest of them all...

[dan foster]

I'm sort of getting tired of you calling me a liar, this is not the first time.....http://www.thebody.com/content/art5942.html

The San Francisco Unified School District (SFUSD) established their Support Services for Gay, Lesbian & Bisexual Youth program because of their belief that "[a]ll students within the SFUSD have a right to an education in a safe and nurturing enviroment. This includes students who are gay, lesbian, bisexual, or those who are questioning their sexuality."

In the St. Paul public schools, the "Out for Equity" program provides voluntary support groups for gay and lesbian students in three schools. The program's materials make quite clear that it is not a part of the curriculum, it is completely voluntary, and there is no recruiting or advocating of homosexuality.

this is just a few from this article, I have read there are thousand of public schools that have special classes set up for gay awareness...

and I'm NOT saying religion should be PUSHED on anybody..........I'm with you 100%, always have been Dan......It IS a personal choice...PERIOD......Please get that through your head..........I, along with most Christians believe that....I'm saying there have been cases where some schools will NOT allow Christian groups to meet on school property after school hours....and I think that is wrong...but, allowing the Gay Values be taught on the Federal Dime.....double standard as far as I'm concerned......

and I sure do agree that we should be back to teaching the 3 R's.....and leave the rest to the parents to teach....

Thanks for clarifyng.  You aren't a liar, you are just stupid.  The two gay/lesbian citations you use say nothing about celebrating "gay and lesbian" days in any way whatsoever.  They are support groups for a battered class of students and they are not "allowing the teaching of Gay Values on the Federal dime".  Nice strawman as I pointed out.  Another non issue presented as a war on christianity.     Christians have a big problem with credibility already (believing in ghosts, et al) without some of you making shiite up.

Now, most school systems (MOST) allow after school, non-required religious organizations to meet.  If certain groups were not allowed it is probably because they are also some sort of hate group.  I don't think I would allow the Arian Nation or Westboro Baptist, self described "christian groups" to meet on my school grounds, either.  I am guessing in this case, so without some evidence from you on exactly what group has been denied, then I think your strawman has completely fallen apart and you are full of it, as usual.

[dan foster]

you are the best example I have seen of an angry atheist...........................you despise everything our Country stands for as far a its heritage of God and Country.............it is loaded with it, and YOUR leader ( ) Dawkins.....is the angriest of them all...

Angry, how so.  Now you are just lying as I don't think you are that stupid.  How do I "espise everything our Country stands for as far a its heritage of God and Country"?  I do despise those who want to rewrite history where the crackpot pilgrims and puritans won and we are under a theocracy, vice what really happened. 

We live in a secular country under a secular Constitution and there isn't anything you can do about it, beyond treason.  I support and defend the Constitution of the United States and you and your ilk will never win on your puritanical wonderlust, no matter how hard you pray for the revision of our history.  Never. 

Now, does that sound angry?  Treason against what our country does stand for does make me angry, but I can assure you, your attempt to undermine that is only laughable.  There are only a handfull of you that have never read our history and get what you DO think you know from a another handfull of nutcases like Kennedy, camped out in the same FL area as the likes of Mark Foley and other "deceivers of men" ;>)  You owe somebody a lot of rams, or is that Ewe owe someone some rams?   

1And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

2If a soul sin, and commit a trespass against the LORD, and lie unto his neighbour in that which was delivered him to keep, or in fellowship, or in a thing taken away by violence, or hath deceived his neighbour;

3Or have found that which was lost, and lieth concerning it, and sweareth falsely; in any of all these that a man doeth, sinning therein:

4Then it shall be, because he hath sinned, and is guilty, that he shall restore that which he took violently away, or the thing which he hath deceitfully gotten, or that which was delivered him to keep, or the lost thing which he found,

5Or all that about which he hath sworn falsely; he shall even restore it in the principal, and shall add the fifth part more thereto, and give it unto him to whom it appertaineth, in the day of his trespass offering.

6And he shall bring his trespass offering unto the LORD, a ram without blemish out of the flock, with thy estimation, for a trespass offering, unto the priest:

7And the priest shall make an atonement for him before the LORD: and it shall be forgiven him for any thing of all that he hath done in trespassing therein.

[lex]

Angry, how so.  Now you are just lying as I don't think you are that stupid.  How do I "espise everything our Country stands for as far a its heritage of God and Country"?  I do despise those who want to rewrite history where the crackpot pilgrims and puritans won and we are under a theocracy, vice what really happened. 

We live in a secular country under a secular Constitution and there isn't anything you can do about it, beyond treason.  I support and defend the Constitution of the United States and you and your ilk will never win on your puritanical wonderlust, no matter how hard you pray for the revision of our history.  Never. 

Now, does that sound angry?  Treason against what our country does stand for does make me angry, but I can assure you, your attempt to undermine that is only laughable.  There are only a handfull of you that have never read our history and get what you DO think you know from a another handfull of nutcases like Kennedy, camped out in the same FL area as the likes of Mark Foley and other "deceivers of men" ;>)  You owe somebody a lot of rams, or is that Ewe owe someone some rams?   

1And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

2If a soul sin, and commit a trespass against the LORD, and lie unto his neighbour in that which was delivered him to keep, or in fellowship, or in a thing taken away by violence, or hath deceived his neighbour;

3Or have found that which was lost, and lieth concerning it, and sweareth falsely; in any of all these that a man doeth, sinning therein:

4Then it shall be, because he hath sinned, and is guilty, that he shall restore that which he took violently away, or the thing which he hath deceitfully gotten, or that which was delivered him to keep, or the lost thing which he found,

5Or all that about which he hath sworn falsely; he shall even restore it in the principal, and shall add the fifth part more thereto, and give it unto him to whom it appertaineth, in the day of his trespass offering.

6And he shall bring his trespass offering unto the LORD, a ram without blemish out of the flock, with thy estimation, for a trespass offering, unto the priest:

7And the priest shall make an atonement for him before the LORD: and it shall be forgiven him for any thing of all that he hath done in trespassing therein.

Nothing here some Prozac wouldn't help.

[dan foster]

Nothing here some Prozac wouldn't help.

Wow, and I wrote all that stuff, and things, and typed with such great anger and, and, and all I get is this?  GRRR!  I am also so shocked ol' hank can't fend for himself and needs your superhero status to argue his point with such eloquence as presented here. 

Do either of you have any kind of data to go on that isn't some manufactured strawman, or just wondrously easy phrases like the one you presented here? 

Now, before you mistake me for being angry, again, please know that I can type (although not without a few errors) much faster than you think (yes, pun intended goddamn it  )

[lex]

Wow, and I wrote all that stuff, and things, and typed with such great anger and, and, and all I get is this?  GRRR!  I am also so shocked ol' hank can't fend for himself and needs your superhero status to argue his point with such eloquence as presented here. 

Do either of you have any kind of data to go on that isn't some manufactured strawman, or just wondrously easy phrases like the one you presented here? 

Now, before you mistake me for being angry, again, please know that I can type (although not without a few errors) much faster than you think (yes, pun intended goddamn it  )

Lies! I smell cut n paste on your breath.