'Faith' As Morality?!?

[Y]

Over the coarse of years, I have found that my FAITH has kept me on the straight and narrow.

Once again I'm going to ask you what relation faith has to morality?

Are you suggesting that you have no inner moral compass and that your morality had to be imposed from an exterior source?

[Sandy Eggo]

I always love this discussion and I'll offer more of my personal opinion as the discussion gets underway, but first I'd like to share a quote that I believe is right on...

"If the only thing keeping a person decent is the expectation of divine reward then, brother, that person is a piece of s***. And I'd like to get as many of them out in the open as possible. You gotta get together and tell yourself stories that violate every law of the universe just to get through the goddamn day? What's that say about your reality?"

Rust Cohle

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/03/12/true-detective-13-rust-cohle-quotes-for-the-ages

[moondance27]

 

I always love this discussion and I'll offer more of my personal opinion as the discussion gets underway, but first I'd like to share a quote that I believe is right on...
Rust Cohle

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/03/12/true-detective-13-rust-cohle-quotes-for-the-ages

[Henry Hawk]

Once again I'm going to ask you what relation faith has to morality?

Are you suggesting that you have no inner moral compass and that your morality had to be imposed from an exterior source?

First of all, I am not suggesting anything.  I merely stated that I found MY FAITH has kept ME on the straight and narrow.  Millions and Millions of people throught out history has this SAME concept because of FAITH in God.  To claim that a person is a peice of shit because of this is just more evidence that those who choose to NOT beleive has a larger motive other than being atheist.  I found that many of those folks are just hateful.

[The Troll]

First of all, I am not suggesting anything.  I merely stated that I found MY FAITH has kept ME on the straight and narrow.  Millions and Millions of people throught out history has this SAME concept because of FAITH in God.  To claim that a person is a peice of shit because of this is just more evidence that those who choose to NOT beleive has a larger motive other than being atheist.  I found that many of those folks are just hateful.

  I don't need a god to keep me straight.     I got my conscience, my wife and the law to keep me straight.   

[Henry Hawk]

  I don't need a god to keep me straight.     I got my conscience, my wife and the law to keep me straight.   

Your poor wife sure does have her hands full!!! 
now that you mention it...........my wife plays a big part in mine too!    But, then she has a strong faith too.  Hey, It works for us.

[Sandy Eggo]

First of all, I am not suggesting anything.  I merely stated that I found MY FAITH has kept ME on the straight and narrow.  Millions and Millions of people throught out history has this SAME concept because of FAITH in God.  To claim that a person is a peice of shit because of this is just more evidence that those who choose to NOT beleive has a larger motive other than being atheist.  I found that many of those folks are just hateful.

My BS detector is in the red zone.

I find that people who are atheist or agnostic have a higher level of character and social responsibility than many of the religious folk claiming that a supreme being greases their moral compass. Why should they behave? They've got the excuse of free will and satan to pass the buck of responsibility and guess what? They can always ask for forgiveness and turn around and continue the low character behavior. Just gotta say a prayer and all is good.

People without those excuses tend to do the right thing because it IS the right thing.

I personally find it sad that some people can't be strong enough to be responsible with claiming the power of an imaginary crutch. 

[The Troll]

My BS detector is in the red zone.

I find that people who are atheist or agnostic have a higher level of character and social responsibility than many of the religious folk claiming that a supreme being greases their moral compass. Why should they behave? They've got the excuse of free will and Satan to pass the buck of responsibility and guess what? They can always ask for forgiveness and turn around and continue the low character behavior. Just gotta say a prayer and all is good.

People without those excuses tend to do the right thing because it IS the right thing.

I personally find it sad that some people can't be strong enough to be responsible with claiming the power of an imaginary crutch.

  Amen Sandy    Let them   and fornicate.   

[Henry Hawk]

My BS detector is in the red zone.

I find that people who are atheist or agnostic have a higher level of character and social responsibility than many of the religious folk claiming that a supreme being greases their moral compass. Why should they behave? They've got the excuse of free will and satan to pass the buck of responsibility and guess what? They can always ask for forgiveness and turn around and continue the low character behavior. Just gotta say a prayer and all is good.

People without those excuses tend to do the right thing because it IS the right thing.

I personally find it sad that some people can't be strong enough to be responsible with claiming the power of an imaginary crutch. 

I actually tend to agree with you to an extent.  Yes, there are plenty of "religious" good-freakin-two-shoed butt-holes, who are, in my opinion big time assholes, who shove their beliefs and can be the nastiest, most unloving pricks on the face of the earth.  But, I also know plenty of atheists who wear a chip on their shoulders who love to ridicule, and demonize good folks who believe.
I think it sad that some people can't get past the fact the FAITH and GOD is important to many.... MILLIONS of folks who are wonderful, caring, giving folks.

[Sandy Eggo]

I actually tend to agree with you to an extent.  Yes, there are plenty of "religious" good-freakin-two-shoed butt-holes, who are, in my opinion big time assholes, who shove their beliefs and can be the nastiest, most unloving pricks on the face of the earth.  But, I also know plenty of atheists who wear a chip on their shoulders who love to ridicule, and demonize good folks who believe.
I think it sad that some people can't get past the fact the FAITH and GOD is important to many.... MILLIONS of folks who are wonderful, caring, giving folks.

Henry, strictly hypothetical, but don't you think you'd still be a moral person even if you weren't a Christian? Is your belief in God the only thing that keeps your from lying, stealing and cheating?

I also agree with you re: people of faith (not just Christians). I know many who are humble, loving and giving people, but I can't imagine they'd be any different without religion.

[Henry Hawk]

Henry, strictly hypothetical, but don't you think you'd still be a moral person even if you weren't a Christian? Is your belief in God the only thing that keeps your from lying, stealing and cheating?

Sandy, please don't get me wrong and think that I think you HAVE to be a person of faith to be a good person.  My own father has never been a "religious" man, but is one of the most giving and kind person I have ever known.  I'm certain, I am the way I am because of him AND my mother, who also never attended Church and was extremely loving and giving.  So YES, I would have been a very moral person WITHOUT being a Christian.  So don't get me wrong, I do not think that calling yourself a Christian makes a person better than the next guy.

What I get from being a Christian, is faith.  Faith that there IS INDEED, something much bigger than what this world has to offer.  That there is a GOD, that there is a Son of God and that there is INDEED an enternal life after this one.   A faith that assures me when times get hard, that I will endure it.  My Faith gives me confidence.  It brings me peace, comfort and contentment. 
Believing in God doesn't keep you from lying, stealing and cheating.....I think everybody, regardless of religion, has to deal with those things there own way.
I am kind of rambing, but to sum it up, for me, having faith keeps my chin up, when things get tough.  Helps me love when I want to hate, to laugh when I want to cry.
I am not preaching or suggesting anything, but THIS is what works for me and my family.  I wouldn't want it any other way.

[The Troll]

Sandy, please don't get me wrong and think that I think you HAVE to be a person of faith to be a good person.  My own father has never been a "religious" man, but is one of the most giving and kind person I have ever known.  I'm certain, I am the way I am because of him AND my mother, who also never attended Church and was extremely loving and giving.  So YES, I would have been a very moral person WITHOUT being a Christian.  So don't get me wrong, I do not think that calling yourself a Christian makes a person better than the next guy.

What I get from being a Christian, is faith.  Faith that there IS INDEED, something much bigger than what this world has to offer.  That there is a GOD, that there is a Son of God and that there is INDEED an enternal life after this one.   A faith that assures me when times get hard, that I will endure it.  My Faith gives me confidence.  It brings me peace, comfort and contentment. 
Believing in God doesn't keep you from lying, stealing and cheating.....I think everybody, regardless of religion, has to deal with those things there own way.
I am kind of rambing, but to sum it up, for me, having faith keeps my chin up, when things get tough.  Helps me love when I want to hate, to laugh when I want to cry.
I am not preaching or suggesting anything, but THIS is what works for me and my family.  I wouldn't want it any other way.

  Yes Sir, you can thank your dad, General Motors and the UAW.  :thumbs:

[Y]

What I get from being a Christian, is faith.  Faith that there IS INDEED, something much bigger than what this world has to offer.  That there is a GOD, that there is a Son of God and that there is INDEED an enternal life after this one.   A faith that assures me when times get hard, that I will endure it.  My Faith gives me confidence.  It brings me peace, comfort and contentment.

To me those comments say that a crutch is required to face the reality of the world as it is.

What is there to fear about this world and form of existence being all there is?

Why do you need an authoritarian, daddy - yeah, always male - figure, and his son somewhere up there in the sky to enable you to do, be, and feel all those things? 

Why do you have to limit this amazing and wonderful universe and our place in it to some petty jealous god and demi-god, based on exaggerated versions of ourselves, who supposedly rule the entire universe, but are so inept this one small planet can't be run to their tale of heaven.

I just don't get it, and never have.

[Sandy Eggo]

[me]

That pretty much sums it up IMHO