FACT CHECK: Are rich taxed less than secretaries?

[The Troll]

  You steel cladded headed idiots.  I'm tired of your crap.  Your wonderful George W. got us into this depression.  I taking a vacation from you twins.  Have at, I not going to argue with you now.  Until the election come closer.  You can put out all of your Teabagger crap.  The Zoners know what the crap is.     I'm taking a rest.            <------ And you twins can swim all you want too.   

[Exterminator]

Ya, I could'a sat here and wrote out a big college type explanation of how that works but if ya ain't smart enough to see what's comin' ya wouldn't understand it anyway.

Because you and your cohort, both of whom have proven yourselves abject failures at managing even your own personal finances, are well equipped to understand something as complex as the entire country's economic system; right?

[Exterminator]

THAT is the only way we can truly turn things around.....JOBS, JOBS, JOBS.

Jobs doing what, genius?

[me]

Because you and your cohort, both of whom have proven yourselves abject failures at managing even your own personal finances, are well equipped to understand something as complex as the entire country's economic system; right?

I'm smart enough to know ya can't/shouldn't be spending money ya don't have and going further into debt by spending more and depending on someone else to pay your bills doesn't work and that is exactly what's going on.  You just go ahead living in your credit card dream world and you'll be off in lala land somewhere when it hits and still have no clue what happened. 

[Henry Hawk]

Because you and your cohort, both of whom have proven yourselves abject failures at managing even your own personal finances, are well equipped to understand something as complex as the entire country's economic system; right?

That is why you are a prick...............you always try to make things personal and make attacks instead of talking about the issues....You are arrogant into believing that only YOU have the intelligence to understand our economic system...........why do you even come here?.........do you not have a life?.....you spend most of your day here, trying to prove something that no one gives a shit about....is it your lifes goal to change me and me?.....


methinks you need a new hobby.

[Exterminator]

I'm smart enough to know ya can't/shouldn't be spending money ya don't have and going further into debt by spending more and depending on someone else to pay your bills doesn't work and that is exactly what's going on.  You just go ahead living in your credit card dream world and you'll be off in lala land somewhere when it hits and still have no clue what happened.

Really?  So where were you when Bush was doing that?

[The Troll]

  EX, you got to be more sensitive.  They want to live in their La La Land with their stupid ideas and prejudices.

  Did you see that "ME" thinks that this George W's depression was caused by the few people who don't want to work. 

[Exterminator]

That is why you are a prick...............you always try to make things personal and make attacks instead of talking about the issues....You are arrogant into believing that only YOU have the intelligence to understand our economic system...........why do you even come here?.........do you not have a life?.....you spend most of your day here, trying to prove something that no one gives a shit about....is it your lifes goal to change me and me?.....

methinks you need a new hobby.

I'm simply stating facts and the facts are that the biggest reason all of this spending was necessary was because of the near collapse of the world economy due to the mortgage derivative debacle and you are one of the people directly responsible for it.  Now you want to point the finger at everyone else, talk about how fucked up they are and tell us all about your solutions to fix the problem that you helped cause!  And I'm arrogant?

It's ironic that you accuse me of that while deluding yourself into believing that you have any understanding of economics whatsoever despite your complete lack of any formal education on the subject.  Sorry but your "common sense" ploy doesn't work with me; it is not a substitute for actual knowledge of a subject even if you had it and the only reading on the subject you've ever done is by other internet experts like yourself.

I guess I could ask you why you come here as well, Henry?  Are you not satisfied with simply being presumed a fool and feel it necessary to come here and prove it every day?

[Henry Hawk]

I'm simply stating facts and the facts are that the biggest reason all of this spending was necessary was because of the near collapse of the world economy due to the mortgage derivative debacle and you are one of the people directly responsible for it.  Now you want to point the finger at everyone else, talk about how fucked up they are and tell us all about your solutions to fix the problem that you helped cause!  And I'm arrogant?

It's ironic that you accuse me of that while deluding yourself into believing that you have any understanding of economics whatsoever despite your complete lack of any formal education on the subject.  Sorry but your "common sense" ploy doesn't work with me; it is not a substitute for actual knowledge of a subject even if you had it and the only reading on the subject you've ever done is by other internet experts like yourself.

I guess I could ask you why you come here as well, Henry?  Are you not satisfied with simply being presumed a fool and feel it necessary to come here and prove it every day?

The only thing foolish I am guilty of is hanging out with fools........

(this is not aimed at everyone here on the forum...you know exactly who I am referring too....)

I have to say this, for a guy who is a self-proclaimed educated person in economics.....you could not be more wrong.  If you honestly believe that Obama's spending a TRILLION dollars SAVED the world from collapsing....then I have nothing else to say or discuss.

[Exterminator]

Not self proclaimed...I have transcripts to prove it.  You should quit hanging out with those fools...they're filling your head with bullshit and lies that you then come here and repeat.

[me]

I'm simply stating facts and the facts are that the biggest reason all of this spending was necessary was because of the near collapse of the world economy due to the mortgage derivative debacle and you are one of the people directly responsible for it.  Now you want to point the finger at everyone else, talk about how fucked up they are and tell us all about your solutions to fix the problem that you helped cause!  And I'm arrogant?

It's ironic that you accuse me of that while deluding yourself into believing that you have any understanding of economics whatsoever despite your complete lack of any formal education on the subject.  Sorry but your "common sense" ploy doesn't work with me; it is not a substitute for actual knowledge of a subject even if you had it and the only reading on the subject you've ever done is by other internet experts like yourself.

I guess I could ask you why you come here as well, Henry?  Are you not satisfied with simply being presumed a fool and feel it necessary to come here and prove it every day?

Tell me something Ex how is HH even remotely responsible for that mortgage mess?  That started with Clinton and you know it.  You dealt, or deal, with commercial properties which are different than housing and don't tell me I don't know what I'm talking about either because I've sold both and helped obtain loans for both.  You would not have known about the types of mortgages which were made available for home owners because there would have been no need for you to know.  All you know about are conventional loans and business loans.  Under Clinton the secondary market had so many different kinds of no down payment, no statement, low income type loans available it was hard for the loan officers to keep up with them and some banks didn't, and wouldn't, even offer them.  They were mostly obtained through mortgage brokers who dealt with several mortgage companies and obtained the loans through the one that fit the buyer or person refinancing the best.  Investors bought properties through them because of the relaxed rules and you could borrow more than the home was actually worth to get money back in your pocket at closing.  That was strictly a Clinton democrat thing and was beginning to tighten up under Bush.  Don't even try to blame the housing bubble on Bush or the conservatives.  If you weren't so busy trying to convenience everyone you know it all you might realize that there are others that may know more about some things than you or at least know as much. 

Oh and for the record, no I didn't sell a huge commercial property it was a couple of smaller ones but that was enough to know it was a whole different ball game from home mortgages. 

Ya know they say the accuser is the doer and I'm beginning to wonder if you are the one in trouble financially here and got yourself in too deep mortgage wise and are trying to dig yourself out of a hole.  You sure seem to want to tag HH and me with it a lot for some reason.

And what is so hard to understand about you spend more than you have and borrow more than you can pay back you're gonna eventually get into trouble from a small scale household to a country?  The only difference is the numbers are larger when it applies to a country but the principle remains the same.  The governments money comes from the people who are going broke and the individuals money comes from their job which a lot of people don't have now.  The governments source of income, us and businesses, varies so there is no way to determine with a certainty how much revenue will be coming in by simply raising taxes because that source of income might not be there when push comes to shove but they seem to spend it before they actually have it and people like you don't seem to understand the difference between theoretical and actual.  It's that "well it works on paper" attitude that gets people like you into trouble.

[Exterminator]

Tell me something Ex how is HH even remotely responsible for that mortgage mess?

Simple.  He's one of the people who bought a house he couldn't afford and then defaulted on the mortgage.

That was strictly a Clinton democrat thing and was beginning to tighten up under Bush.  Don't even try to blame the housing bubble on Bush or the conservatives.

You were making some good points until you threw this bullshit into the mix; both parties share the blame on this one.

Ya know they say the accuser is the doer and I'm beginning to wonder if you are the one in trouble financially here and got yourself in too deep mortgage wise and are trying to dig yourself out of a hole.  You sure seem to want to tag HH and me with it a lot for some reason.

LMAO!  Nice try...don't throw your shoulder out of joint reaching.

And what is so hard to understand about you spend more than you have and borrow more than you can pay back you're gonna eventually get into trouble from a small scale household to a country?

Well, that all sounds very good except that it is an overly simplistic view of a very complicated problem.  You and Henry seem to have a lot of really simple solutions that somehow continue to evade the well-learned people whose job it is to actually do something to help this failing economy.  Why do you think that is?

That notwithstanding, neither of you has any credibility on the spending issue because you sat silent while Bush ran up a trillion dollars in debt over an unfunded drug program or got us into two wars, one of them completely unneccesarily with a price tag of several trillion dollars.  To come along now and claim that you're suddenly worried about spending money we don't have is disingenuous at best.

Now to the part that you seem to have a difficult time grasping...the economy is faltering at present primarily because no one has any money to spend.  Traditional economic wisdom dictates that at such times, the government must spend money to keep the economy moving, however slowly.  If the government stops spending now, we will certainly see a depression, the results of which will be much graver and much more violent than the depression in the 30's.  Is that what you're advocating?

[Henry Hawk]

better get your facts straight before you blow your mouth off...but, that seems to be what you are best at.

[Exterminator]

Which facts are those?

[The Troll]

Which facts are those?

  Ex, I asked Henery to answer one question.  I  asked him what bill,  what action, law that the Republican Party passed that was for the betterment of the American work classes.  No tax cut need to be given.   Cricket, cricket, cricket.

  Do you think that Hawk is not informed or not smart enough to answer it.