How far do we go to keep America safe?...

[Henry Hawk]

Would you waterboard a terrorist to save thousands of American lives?.....THAT is gone now.

What do we do? 

[me]

I am not a violent person but yes, I think I would use water boarding.  Although it appears to be unpleasant it isn't harmful and, like I mentioned in an earlier thread, it leaves the head attached to the body. 

[Sandy Eggo]

[Henry Hawk]

rolling your eyes is your answer to keeping America Safe?....

I think this is a serious question....do we even need a CIA?

[Sandy Eggo]

So, based on that logic, then it is also reasonable for countries who fear the integrity of the US to torture Americans in the name of safety also, correct?

[me]

So, based on that logic, then it is also reasonable for countries who fear the integrity of the US to torture Americans in the name of safety also, correct?

Just in case you hadn't noticed several American's were beheaded which is far worse than a little water boarding.

[Henry Hawk]

So, based on that logic, then it is also reasonable for countries who fear the integrity of the US to torture Americans in the name of safety also, correct?

Everybody has got to do what they have to do secure their freedoms or rights or whatever it is they feel is worth dying for........and there is a price to pay for your/their actions.....

I for one want our Country to do what ever it takes to secure our freedom....and I think we can and have done it without cutting off the heads of anyone....we do more to accommodate the needs of prisoners than anybody else in the world.....

We have lead the world in giving food, supplies, money, and support to assure those who desire freedom.....

This waterboarding, is an extreme measure that has been used, sparingly but effectively.....and when done properly, is a physically safe tactic that has been successful in getting important information to keep Americans safe....

What leverage do we have left, to assure our freedoms....it is tying our hands.....and when the next attack comes....and it COULD have been aborted, simply by receiving pertinent information by those, in our captive confides.....it WILL be an extremely sad day.

[Sandy Eggo]

So, I mention other countries and you bring up the actions of terrorists...not the same thing...but I'm sure the difference is lost on you two as I'm also sure that if an American were treated that way by government officials of another country y'all would be all up at arms full of rationalizations and accusations about what awful people they are. In other words, torture is a good thing if WE do it.

[me]

IT IS NOT TORTURE!!!!!!  The people who use the methods are put under the same treatment so they will not only know how it feels but how to do it properly.  Our special forces are subjected to it to prepare them in case they are captured.  Torture is being beaten, having your fingernails torn out one by one, being put through a plastic shredder feet first, having your arms and/or legs broken, having one finger at a time cut off......shall I name more?

[me]

Let me ask this.  How would you go about getting information from a prisoner? 

[Sandy Eggo]

Cute definition of "torture". Make that up yourself did you?

[me]

No, as a matter of fact those are methods some of our enemy's have used.  Read an actual history book.

[Henry Hawk]

So, I mention other countries and you bring up the actions of terrorists...not the same thing...but I'm sure the difference is lost on you two as I'm also sure that if an American were treated that way by government officials of another country y'all would be all up at arms full of rationalizations and accusations about what awful people they are. In other words, torture is a good thing if WE do it.

First of all, where did I mention terrorists?.............Secondly, I would be gratefull, if ALL our enemy did was waterboard my soldier instead of sawing his head off!! or having his eyelids cutoff...or having bamboo shoots hammered under his fingernails....or having his genitals hooked up to a car battery...THOSE are physically damaging and deadly....

I said from the beginning, countries got to do what they got to do....I say, if you harm ONE of our soldiers, in ANY way, shape or form....there will be consequences to pay....you call that being a bully....I call it standing up for freedom.

the whole thing is an ugly issue...and I wish there was NO need for it....but unfortunately, it DOES happen...at least, the US has/was taken the high road, but still able to obtain information that HAS aborted missions that would have taken American lives.

[me]

Cute definition of "torture". Make that up yourself did you?

You still haven't answered my question.  How would you suggest we get information which may save American lives?

[LOsborne]

Secondly, I would be gratefull, if ALL our enemy did was waterboard my soldier instead of sawing his head off!! or having his eyelids cutoff...or having bamboo shoots hammered under his fingernails....or having his genitals hooked up to a car battery...THOSE are physically damaging and deadly....

I said from the beginning, countries got to do what they got to do....I say, if you harm ONE of our soldiers, in ANY way, shape or form....there will be consequences to pay....you call that being a bully....I call it standing up for freedom.

Looks to me like you have too different motives going on here. First you talk about using torture to obtain information, and then this last post sounds like you want retribution.

Just this week we learned that Khalid Shaikh Mohammed was subjected to waterboarding 183 times. How much information did they think he had? Or was it just that he never told them anything, so they figured number 182, 3, 4, ... was the magic key?

To get any kind of real evaluation of the usefulness of an interrogation technique, we must be able to judge the truth of the information revealed, and the amount of time it takes to obtain truthful information. All the figures I have seen say the info revealed under any interrogation technique (including torture) ranges from real old news to fantasy-land, with an occasional factoid of value thrown in. So how do we judge what is real?

The time-honored police method of paid informants has a pretty good track record. So long as the government is tossing my money around, I would be happier if the CIA bought some information that could then be verified, rather than tormenting some fanatic until he told them aliens had aligned with his jihad, and were burrowing up from the center of the earth.

Now, before you go telling me about how they deserve it, because they beheaded people, I must point out I don't believe the beheading netted any information useful to their cause -- especially after the fact! And as a purported Christian, I am shocked that you even suggest sinking to their level.

Personally, if you fed me brussel sprouts and played non-stop elevator music at a high volume, I would tell you everything you wanted to know. Whether it was true or not.