Some more wasted tax dollars by our Federal Government..... Lets give some more solar companies money. :rant:
http://www.indystar.com/article/20120628/BUSINESS/120628042/Abound-Solar-which-planned-employ-up-1-000-Tipton-will-file-bankruptcy?odyssey=nav|head
Quote from: me on June 29, 2012, 06:33:04 PM
Some more wasted tax dollars by our Federal Government..... Lets give some more solar companies money. :rant:
http://www.indystar.com/article/20120628/BUSINESS/120628042/Abound-Solar-which-planned-employ-up-1-000-Tipton-will-file-bankruptcy?odyssey=nav|head
I'll tell you what to do. After George W. give and I do mean gave the big banks a Trillion dollars to save their ass. What did they just do. Hell, they just lost another 9 Billion dollars on bad deals. I sure glad George W. is gone, he'd give them another Trillion Dollars. What is so bad by losing a few million dollars try to create job and new technology here in America. More sour grapes from the England Grape Queen. You little red headed butter ball. :kiss:
One of the most prolific "facts" you conservatives have been throwing around to argue against solar energy solutions, is the high cost of such technology.
Abound Solar went bankrupt because even before they could implement their business plan the costs dove drastically; meaning the cost per unit that was the key stone of their business plan was no longer executable.
The Feds saw this, among other things, and withheld funding beyond the initial payout; saving the taxpayers millions in further losses.
But lets hype things up and engage in histrionics why don't we? :roll eyes:
The fact is the cost of solar technology to the end users has dropped substantially, specifically because the competition was created by the Federal backing designed to do exactly that. Some businesses will fail along the way, as with any sector of industry.
Just because a group starts a business doesn't mean it will become a success; financially or otherwise. If it did we'd all be business owners. . . :rolleyes:
I heard it said one time. That over 90% of the small restaurants go out of business with in a year. Why? The lack of capital. That's why chain restaurant last longer, they got the corporation to back them up. :yes:
Quote from: Palehorse on July 03, 2012, 11:47:03 AM
One of the most prolific "facts" you conservatives have been throwing around to argue against solar energy solutions, is the high cost of such technology.
Abound Solar went bankrupt because even before they could implement their business plan the costs dove drastically; meaning the cost per unit that was the key stone of their business plan was no longer executable.
The Feds saw this, among other things, and withheld funding beyond the initial payout; saving the taxpayers millions in further losses.
But lets hype things up and engage in histrionics why don't we? :roll eyes:
The fact is the cost of solar technology to the end users has dropped substantially, specifically because the competition was created by the Federal backing designed to do exactly that. Some businesses will fail along the way, as with any sector of industry.
Just because a group starts a business doesn't mean it will become a success; financially or otherwise. If it did we'd all be business owners. . . :rolleyes:
Shameless bump. . . :icon_twisted:
Quote from: The Troll on July 03, 2012, 11:57:15 AM
I heard it said one time. That over 90% of the small restaurants go out of business with in a year. Why? The lack of capital. That's why chain restaurant last longer, they got the corporation to back them up. :yes:
Quit supporting chain resaurants then. Eat at local "mom & pops"....I would rather eat at a local "dive" than a chain ANYDAY.
Quote from: Palehorse on July 03, 2012, 11:47:03 AM
One of the most prolific "facts" you conservatives have been throwing around to argue against solar energy solutions, is the high cost of such technology.
Abound Solar went bankrupt because even before they could implement their business plan the costs dove drastically; meaning the cost per unit that was the key stone of their business plan was no longer executable.
The Feds saw this, among other things, and withheld funding beyond the initial payout; saving the taxpayers millions in further losses.
But lets hype things up and engage in histrionics why don't we? :roll eyes:
The fact is the cost of solar technology to the end users has dropped substantially, specifically because the competition was created by the Federal backing designed to do exactly that. Some businesses will fail along the way, as with any sector of industry.
Just because a group starts a business doesn't mean it will become a success; financially or otherwise. If it did we'd all be business owners. . . :rolleyes:
Oh, is that why they went defunct in the 80's? I could have sworn it was because they turned out to be worthless unless you went to the added cost of a storage system which was extremely costly and didn't save enough to make it worthwhile because you still needed a backup system.
Quote from: me on July 03, 2012, 01:37:40 PM
Oh, is that why they went defunct in the 80's? I could have sworn it was because they turned out to be worthless unless you went to the added cost of a storage system which was extremely costly and didn't save enough to make it worthwhile because you still needed a backup system.
No, they did not go defunct in the 80's. Do you take the time to learn about anything before you open your pie-hole?
Quote from: Exterminator on July 03, 2012, 01:53:10 PM
No, they did not go defunct in the 80's. Do you take the time to learn about anything before you open your pie-hole?
How many new installations have you seen lately?
Anyway the whole point is he poured more money into a business that went bankrupt.
Quote from: me on July 03, 2012, 01:59:39 PM
How many new installations have you seen lately?
There are new installations being built all of the time; look it up.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 03, 2012, 01:12:40 PM
Quit supporting chain resaurants then. Eat at local "mom & pops"....I would rather eat at a local "dive" than a chain ANYDAY.
I'm not supporting anyone. I just stated the hard cold facts in a Capitalist world. The big eat the little for lunch. :yes: :yes:
Quote from: The Troll on July 03, 2012, 03:19:29 PM
I'm not supporting anyone. I just stated the hard cold facts in a Capitalist world. The big eat the little for lunch. :yes: :yes:
If we are able to product a battery that will store all of the energy we need to operate a car or a house. The oil and gas companies are in real trouble. That will really bring solar and wind to the forefront. :biggrin:
Quote from: The Troll on July 03, 2012, 03:24:32 PM
If we are able to product a battery that will store all of the energy we need to operate a car or a house. The oil and gas companies are in real trouble. That will really bring solar and wind to the forefront. :biggrin:
and in a capitalist world, if there is money to be made by such a battery that could operate a car or house, it will happen. If there is money to be made by solar and wind, it will happen. But the government GIVING it money is not the way to accomplish it. The crooks will keep the money, and not do anything with it...such as Solyndra.
There has to be a REAL market and a price that will honestly save the consumer before it will work.
have a happy fourth to you too Troll...
Quote from: Henry Hawk on July 03, 2012, 04:00:16 PM
and in a capitalist world, if there is money to be made by such a battery that could operate a car or house, it will happen. If there is money to be made by solar and wind, it will happen. But the government GIVING it money is not the way to accomplish it. The crooks will keep the money, and not do anything with it...such as Solyndra.
There has to be a REAL market and a price that will honestly save the consumer before it will work.
have a happy fourth to you too Troll...
While you're beating you drum on this like the Energizer Bunny. Your George W. gave the crooked bankers over a Trillion dollars. What about that Hawk. The republican party and George W. gave and I mean gave, with out any pay back time. Your guys gave crooked bankers a Trillion dollars. Hawk that is a 1,000 Million dollars bills and you're bitching about a few million dollar bills. What about that? :doh:
You think that is all right for the republicans to spend Trillions, but let government not Obama give a couple a million, you want to give birth to a calf blaming O0 Obama. :jester:
Give it a break, Henry. Can you tell me how much money and gold Mitt Romney, the Golden Mitten has in his Swiss bank account. You know we have never had a president that had a Swiss bank account. :007: Obama O0 doesn't have a Swiss bank account, Do you have one Henry. :haha: :haha: :haha:
Quote from: Exterminator on July 03, 2012, 01:53:10 PM
. . . Do you take the time to learn about anything before you open your pie-hole?
I hope that was a rhetorical question. . . :biggrin:
Quote from: Exterminator on July 03, 2012, 01:53:10 PM
No, they did not go defunct in the 80's. Do you take the time to learn about anything before you open your pie-hole?
They eidn't exactly become the answer they were supposed to have been either. Since you think they're so great and you talk like you have a lot of money why don't you have solar panels, or do you?
Quote from: me on July 04, 2012, 03:09:34 PM
They eidn't exactly become the answer they were supposed to have been either. Since you think they're so great and you talk like you have a lot of money why don't you have solar panels, or do you?
He probably don't have them like I don't have them. His and my house wasn't designed for them. But I sure would use them, if I had them. Sweet Sue. :kiss:
Quote from: The Troll on July 04, 2012, 03:51:24 PM
He probably don't have them like I don't have them. His and my house wasn't designed for them. But I sure would use them, if I had them. Sweet Sue. :kiss:
Your house has a roof doesn't it? That's where I've seen most of them except for a couple of larger houses that had them along their south wall top to bottom front to back. Of course you'd need room for battery storage too I guess which is where the problem comes in.
Quote from: me on July 04, 2012, 04:07:23 PM
Your house has a roof doesn't it? That's where I've seen most of them except for a couple of larger houses that had them along their south wall top to bottom front to back. Of course you'd need room for battery storage too I guess which is where the problem comes in.
I can see you know little about solar panels and the problem of installing and maintaining the electrical part of using them. You just don't throw them up on the roof and plug them in. There is a little more technical things that must be done that I can see you don't know anything about. It a little about your thinking level. Old Girl. :kiss:
Quote from: me on July 04, 2012, 03:09:34 PM
They eidn't exactly become the answer they were supposed to have been either.
Again, you need to do some research before you speak on matters you know nothing about. There are lots of large solar farms in use, especially on government and military installations and they continue to gain in popularity.
QuoteSince you think they're so great and you talk like you have a lot of money why don't you have solar panels, or do you?
We have discussed the possibility of adding both solar panels and a vertical wind turbine. The latter would probably be more sppropriate for Indiana weather...the former for some place like California or Arizona.
Back to Abound Solar...and Solyndra...the reason that these companies are failing is not because they didn't have good business plans or make good products, they simply can't compete with China whose solar industry is subsidized and whose labor force works for far less money than it would take to even survive here. We used to hold the renewal of China's favored nation trade status as a bargaining chip to encourage them to continue to improve their human rights record. Your boy, George W. Bush, in all of his infinite wisdom, made it permanent removing the last barrier preventing them from flooding our ports with their crap. That you get so gleeful about these American companies failing and putting their employees out of work just because it gives you an opportunity to further criticize the black man you hate is treasonous, in my opinion.
Quote from: me on July 04, 2012, 04:07:23 PM
Of course you'd need room for battery storage too I guess which is where the problem comes in.
No, you don't; they are wired into your existing electrical service and any power you don't use goes out to the power grid.
Quote from: Exterminator on July 04, 2012, 04:18:31 PM
No, you don't; they are wired into your existing electrical service and any power you don't use goes out to the power grid.
And if the sun don't shine you're up shit creek 'cause it ain't gonna generate squat.
You two are sooooo beyond funny. You are posting the problems with them yourselves so I don't have to. Oh and on Solyndra. They were already in trouble and shouldn't have been given the money in the first place and, in fact, they were advised against it but did it anyway. And here we go with the blame game again that is getting real old ya know.
Also I wouldn't go so far as to say there are "lots" of solar farms in the US. Now I did find a few which put into operation during the Bush administration and some that went into the planning stages then but I didn't find "lots" of them. which were already operational in the US.
http://oilprice.com/Alternative-Energy/Solar-Energy/The-Coming-Boom-In-U.S.-Solar-Farms.html
http://www.firstsolar.com/Projects/Projects-Under-Development/Topaz-Solar-Farm/Overview
Quote from: me on July 04, 2012, 05:51:28 PM
And if the sun don't shine you're up shit creek 'cause it ain't gonna generate squat.
Without the sun, we're all up shit creek, Einstein.
As for the rest of your rant, did you even bother to read the articles you posted links to? One of them said almost exactly the same thing I have been saying.
Quote from: Exterminator on July 04, 2012, 05:56:23 PM
Without the sun, we're all up shit creek, Einstein.
As for the rest of your rant, did you even bother to read the articles you posted links to? One of them said almost exactly the same thing I have been saying.
There are times in the winter where the sun doesn't shine for days at a time which would make solar panels for a home without a backup system worthless. As far as there being "lots" of solar farms no, there aren't "lots" of them operational. There are a few operational, more under construction and some still in the planning stages. If, as the first article states, only 1% of the power in the US was being generated from solar power in 2008 how, knowing how long it takes from planning to operational, could there possibly be "lots" of solar farms now. Of course I guess it depends on what you think the meaning of the word "lots" is. To me "lots" would be at least over 40%.
Quote from: me on July 04, 2012, 06:19:34 PM
There are times in the winter where the sun doesn't shine for days at a time which would make solar panels for a home without a backup system worthless.
No one advocated that approach.
QuoteAs far as there being "lots" of solar farms no, there aren't "lots" of them operational.
Indeed there are! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_photovoltaic_power_stations) I never limited my inclusion to the U.S. only as we tend to be very slow in embracing alternative energy sources compared to other countries.
Quote from: Exterminator on July 04, 2012, 06:28:40 PM
No one advocated that approach.
Indeed there are! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_photovoltaic_power_stations) I never limited my inclusion to the U.S. only as we tend to be very slow in embracing alternative energy sources compared to other countries.
Oh, so now since I was only talking about homes and you couldn't come up with anything you change it to farms and when I pointed out the fact there weren't "lots" in the US you move to include other countries. Brilliant move. Remind me to never play chess with you 'cause I'll bet you cheat. :wink:
Quote from: Exterminator on July 04, 2012, 04:18:31 PM
No, you don't; they are wired into your existing electrical service and any power you don't use goes out to the power grid.
There are off the grid homes. They use batteries for cloudy days and at night. But they are not in Indiana where in the winter you can have up to 37 days without sunshine. I know that for certain. Because I knew a guy what built a new solar heated home here in Indiana. He said he should have built the house with more insulation, geothermal heat pump and better windows. He also said, with no sunshine and snow covering the panels it not worth the money building a solar heated house in Indiana. :yes:
Most off the grid places are where the sun shine most of the time. :yes:
Quote from: me on July 04, 2012, 05:51:28 PM
And if the sun don't shine you're up shit creek 'cause it ain't gonna generate squat.
You two are sooooo beyond funny. You are posting the problems with them yourselves so I don't have to.
Are including the Troll when you say you two. :confused: Henry has been on today. :yes:
Quote from: me on July 04, 2012, 06:32:51 PM
Oh, so now since I was only talking about homes and you couldn't come up with anything you change it to farms and when I pointed out the fact there weren't "lots" in the US you move to include other countries. Brilliant move. Remind me to never play chess with you 'cause I'll bet you cheat.
No, you said that solar panels did not pan out to be what they were promised and that they fizzled out in the 80's and I said they did not and that there were lots of large solar installations. There are; you are wrong. The reason that you shouldn't play chess with me is that you're a moron and you'll undoubtedly get your ass handed to you on a plate.
Quote from: The Troll on July 04, 2012, 06:38:18 PM
There are off the grid homes. They use batteries for cloudy days and at night. But they are not in Indiana where in the winter you can have up to 37 days without sunshine. I know that for certain. Because I knew a guy what built a new solar heated home here in Indiana. He said he should have built the house with more insulation, geothermal heat pump and better windows. He also said, with no sunshine and snow covering the panels it not worth the money building a solar heated house in Indiana. :yes:
Most off the grid places are where the sun shine most of the time. :yes:
Oh but Ex said they're all over the place so you must be wrong. Oh no, wait I was talking about Indiana and he was including other countries..... :rolleyes:
Spin....spin....spin.....I'm surprised yer not dizzy
I also so know a man who was in the heating business, the father in law to the guy that built the solar heated house.
Many years ago he put up a good sized wind mill on his property. Had the whole set up, a big bank of 12 volt batteries and a huge inverter. He had it for about three years until the batteries needed to be replaced. I ask him why he was quitting the wind power project. He said, you will be suprised there isn't that much wind between Anderson and Lapel. No wind, no sun, a lots of clouds, not much for green power here around Anderson, Indiana. :rant:
Yer just too funny Troll. When I was saying it wouldn't work here you were callin' me a liar. Guess I wasn't lyin' after all huh?
Quote from: me on July 04, 2012, 07:03:47 PM
Oh but Ex said they're all over the place so you must be wrong. Oh no, wait I was talking about Indiana and he was including other countries..... :rolleyes:
I should have expected that you were referring to just Indiana since you've never been outside of Madison County. My bad for not remembering how small minds work.
Quote from: Exterminator on July 04, 2012, 07:23:15 PM
I should have expected that you were referring to just Indiana since you've never been outside of Madison County. My bad for not remembering how small minds work.
And you know I haven't been outside of Madison County how?
Quote from: me on July 04, 2012, 07:20:19 PM
Yer just too funny Troll. When I was saying it wouldn't work here you were callin' me a liar. Guess I wasn't lyin' after all huh?
It will work in Indiana in certain areas. Indiana has wind corridors where there is more wind. They are presently building wind turbines between Elwood and Marion right now. But Anderson isn't the place to build wind turbines. Sweetie Pie. :kiss: