Ted Koppel Tells Shocking Truth About Iraq and War on Terror

[bevis]

if there is significant dissent to the point where it is hurting morale and affecting troop performance, than shouldn't there be significant review of the reasons that they are fighting?  haven't we been here before?

[Henry Hawk]

i don't believe our troops are suffering or performing poorly, but for them to hear our own, tell the enemy that just wait it out, kind of let air out of the sails...............that is the way i see it anyway....

[bevis]

i get that.  but i guess i'm looking at it from my wacky legal perspective.  if you ask for relief (stop calling for the troops to come home, etc.), you have to show you are damaged (troops are being undermined).  if the troops are being undermined, than you have to show how.  if their performance isn't being affected, than how are they being undermined? 

this is exactly what politicians do.  by using inflammatory language ("undermining the troops") they divert the issue away from the substantive facts.  since nobody wants to be accused of not supporting the troops, if you can equate dissenting about the war in general with not supporting the troops then you can effectively suppress the voices of dissent.  haven't we been here before?

[Henry Hawk]

i get that.  but i guess i'm looking at it from my wacky legal perspective.  if you ask for relief (stop calling for the troops to come home, etc.), you have to show you are damaged (troops are being undermined).  if the troops are being undermined, than you have to show how.  if their performance isn't being affected, than how are they being undermined? 

this is exactly what politicians do.  by using inflammatory language ("undermining the troops") they divert the issue away from the substantive facts.  since nobody wants to be accused of not supporting the troops, if you can equate dissenting about the war in general with not supporting the troops then you can effectively suppress the voices of dissent.  haven't we been here before?

I do not disagree with you, the VP is playing hardball right back with those who are wanting a pull out.....so he is using inflammatory language, I agree, but the bottom line is still the same....the troops do not need to hear the country telling the enemey, things like....we made a mistake, we got to pull out...this is becoming so political, that you don't have to have any proof, to see that it has to mess with the minds of our troops, to an extent anyway....

I guess, to me, I wish we would be united on this war....as far as economy, or immigration, or global warming, or any other issue, fine, disagree all you want...call the president whatever........but, everybody was in favor of sending these guys there....so they are there, lets support them 100%....

[followsthewolf]

Henry, read this article, please.


http://texasobserver.org/article.php?aid=2440

I'm not so sure that "pulling out" is the only possible reason for your concern about the morale of our troops in Iraq.

[Henry Hawk]

Henry, read this article, please.


http://texasobserver.org/article.php?aid=2440

I'm not so sure that "pulling out" is the only possible reason for your concern about the morale of our troops in Iraq.

it is a very good story, and very sad, but...

what is you point about my concern abut morale of our troops in iraq and this story?...

[followsthewolf]

Morale in troops is attacked by much more that what we debate about here at home.

That hasn't changed since 'Nam, either.

When you get sent out to do crap that is obviously not kosher, or you keep getting put in situations where you have to create negative human solutions to extract from hairy situations, nobody gives a rat's *** what the political motivations are back home. All you do is watch out for each other and get out whole.

We back home can debate all we want. Look at the reasons he took his own life. They have nothing to do with "cut and run," "lack of support for the troops," etc., or  any of the myriad of other political reasons we love to ascribe to their morale.

You scratch the surface of soldiers and I'd bet that, if they could speak freely, WHICH THEY CANNOT, many would have some pretty rough opinions about the government that sent them there.

[bevis]

bingo!  remember that our troops are not different from us, they ARE us.  they share the same politics, the same upbringing, the same issues.  if we here at home are divided, you can be sure the troops are too (politically, i mean).  but, as FTW points out, they cannot voice their dissent (if they do).  so who will?  it is your duty if you don't support the war, to speak out.  and same, same if you support the war. 

i saw on news that protestors in Portland were hosed down with fire hoses because they wouldn't "move"!

again i ask, HAVEN'T WE BEEN HERE BEFORE!!!!!!!!!!!!!