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NSA surveillance and data capturing

Started by Exterminator, June 10, 2013, 08:58:30 AM

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Y

The overiding issue here has to due with how can our 'democracy' function if the government keeps secrets from the electorate?

I will admit that there are some - mainly military - things that should be limited, but otherwise our system of government requires an informed electorate and government keeping secrets is the antithesis to that.

Therefore, as it sits, whistleblowers are a necessary check and balance.
©  Whamma-Jamma - all rights reserved

Law of Logical Argument - Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.  ;)

"You've probably noticed that opinion pollsters go out of their way to include as many morons as possible in surveys ... I think it's dangerous to inform morons about what their fellow morons are thinking. It only reinforces their opinions. And the one thing worse than a moron with an opinion is lots of them." -- Scott Adams

In other words: Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.  ;)

"It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends upon his not understanding it." -- Upton Sinclair

"Hitler is gone, but if the majority of our fellow citizens are more susceptible to the slogans of fear and race hatred than to those of peaceful accommodation and mutual respect among human beings, our political liberties remain at the mercy of any eloquent and unscrupulous demagogue." -- S. I. Hayakawa

me

Quote from: Y on July 08, 2013, 01:13:07 PM
In the course of things as they are, it would mean the white person was happy to have the black person to use as a cover for his/her racism on two fronts.

If you're referring to RW black commentators, it makes them money ergo they'd be self-serving.
That's BS and you know it.  It's like saying everyone HAS to agree with the current administration or they're racist no matter what the reason.  That my, dear sir, is racism at it's finest any day of the week. If you don't/can't see that I feel sorry for you. Oh, and I was not referring to just commentators I was referring to blacks in general.  There are a lot of them who are disillusioned with this administration.
Trump 2020

Y

Apparently you can't grasp the difference and that no one said that.
©  Whamma-Jamma - all rights reserved

Law of Logical Argument - Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.  ;)

"You've probably noticed that opinion pollsters go out of their way to include as many morons as possible in surveys ... I think it's dangerous to inform morons about what their fellow morons are thinking. It only reinforces their opinions. And the one thing worse than a moron with an opinion is lots of them." -- Scott Adams

In other words: Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.  ;)

"It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends upon his not understanding it." -- Upton Sinclair

"Hitler is gone, but if the majority of our fellow citizens are more susceptible to the slogans of fear and race hatred than to those of peaceful accommodation and mutual respect among human beings, our political liberties remain at the mercy of any eloquent and unscrupulous demagogue." -- S. I. Hayakawa

me

Quote from: Y on July 18, 2013, 04:48:46 PM
Apparently you can't grasp the difference and that no one said that.
No one has come right out and said "if you disagree with this administration you're a racist" but if you do disagree you're called a racist, same difference.
Trump 2020

Y

That's the same basic fiction.

The reality is that when one can't make any cogent argument for a stated 'policy' disagreement and one's words and actions are such that they tend to leave no other interpretation but that they're prompted by race, then one will in fact be deemed a racist.

Avoid falling under those criteria and one won't have to worry about a charge of racist or racism being aimed in one's direction.

It's not rocket science.
©  Whamma-Jamma - all rights reserved

Law of Logical Argument - Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.  ;)

"You've probably noticed that opinion pollsters go out of their way to include as many morons as possible in surveys ... I think it's dangerous to inform morons about what their fellow morons are thinking. It only reinforces their opinions. And the one thing worse than a moron with an opinion is lots of them." -- Scott Adams

In other words: Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.  ;)

"It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends upon his not understanding it." -- Upton Sinclair

"Hitler is gone, but if the majority of our fellow citizens are more susceptible to the slogans of fear and race hatred than to those of peaceful accommodation and mutual respect among human beings, our political liberties remain at the mercy of any eloquent and unscrupulous demagogue." -- S. I. Hayakawa

me

Quote from: Y on July 18, 2013, 07:12:02 PM
That's the same basic fiction.

The reality is that when one can't make any cogent argument for a stated 'policy' disagreement and one's words and actions are such that they tend to leave no other interpretation but that they're prompted by race, then one will in fact be deemed a racist.

Avoid falling under those criteria and one won't have to worry about a charge of racist or racism being aimed in one's direction.

It's not rocket science.
I will not feign agreement with policies just to placate and keep from being called names.  I don't agree with them and have stated my reasons as have others and, like I keep stating, it would not be realistic to think everyone should agree with this administration like you suggest with your reasoning.
Trump 2020

Sandy Eggo

Quote from: me on July 18, 2013, 07:42:11 PM
I will not feign agreement with policies just to placate and keep from being called names.  I don't agree with them and have stated my reasons as have others and, like I keep stating, it would not be realistic to think everyone should agree with this administration like you suggest with your reasoning.

But yet you've never been able to articulate exactly what those policies are. :think:
Only after the last tree has been cut down. Only after the last river has been poisoned. Only after the last fish has been caught. Only then will you find that money cannot be eaten. - -Cree Indian Prophecy

"Women who strive to be equal to men lack ambitition" -- anonymous

me

Quote from: Sandy Eggo on July 18, 2013, 09:05:04 PM
But yet you've never been able to articulate exactly what those policies are. :think:
I most certainly have but since I, according to some on this forum, am an uneducated idiot you see no point in giving my opinion any credit even though there are other educated people who may hold the same, or similiar, opinion, which you also give no credit to because it doesn't happen to agree with your opinion.  You keep forgetting I didn't like the HCB when Hillary was trying to push it either but I wasn't accused of hating white women.  I didn't like Clinton and his "everybody had a right to own a home" policy either but wasn't accused of hating white men. 
Trump 2020

Sandy Eggo

Quote from: me on July 18, 2013, 09:29:46 PM
I most certainly have but since I, according to some on this forum, am an uneducated idiot you see no point in giving my opinion any credit even though there are other educated people who may hold the same, or similiar, opinion, which you also give no credit to because it doesn't happen to agree with your opinion.  You keep forgetting I didn't like the HCB when Hillary was trying to push it either but I wasn't accused of hating white women.  I didn't like Clinton and his "everybody had a right to own a home" policy either but wasn't accused of hating white men.

And sooooo those policies are......?
Only after the last tree has been cut down. Only after the last river has been poisoned. Only after the last fish has been caught. Only then will you find that money cannot be eaten. - -Cree Indian Prophecy

"Women who strive to be equal to men lack ambitition" -- anonymous

me

Quote from: Sandy Eggo on July 18, 2013, 10:14:08 PM
And sooooo those policies are......?
I will not be drawn into this game ya'll want to play.  If you want to know just go back through the threads.
Trump 2020

Exterminator

Quote from: me on July 18, 2013, 06:03:39 PM
No one has come right out and said "if you disagree with this administration you're a racist" but if you do disagree you're called a racist, same difference.

You aren't a racist because you disagree with this administration; you disagree with this administration because you're a racist.  Big difference.
Arguing with Christians is like playing chess with a pigeon.  No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, shit on the board and strut around like it's victorious.

The truth is slow, but relentless. Over time it becomes irresistible.

Locutus

Quote from: Exterminator on July 19, 2013, 10:29:12 AM
You aren't a racist because you disagree with this administration; you disagree with this administration because you're a racist.  Big difference.

Bingo! 

Lets see if she can wrap her brain around that one.  ;D
One of the gravest dangers to the survival of our republic is an ignorant electorate routinely feeding at the trough of propaganda.   -- Locutus

"We are all connected; To each other, biologically. To the earth, chemically. To the rest of the universe atomically."  -- Dr. Neil deGrasse Tyson

Sandy Eggo

Quote from: me on July 18, 2013, 10:49:50 PM
I will not be drawn into this game ya'll want to play.  If you want to know just go back through the threads.

Translation: "I really don't know anything about any of his policies. I just say that to cover my racist nature."

I've seen this "game" way too many times and never have you been able to support your statement.

Only after the last tree has been cut down. Only after the last river has been poisoned. Only after the last fish has been caught. Only then will you find that money cannot be eaten. - -Cree Indian Prophecy

"Women who strive to be equal to men lack ambitition" -- anonymous

me

Quote from: Exterminator on July 19, 2013, 10:29:12 AM
You aren't a racist because you disagree with this administration; you disagree with this administration because you're a racist.  Big difference.
Whatever skippy.  I guess I've been a man hater and would be a woman hater if Hillary runs and wins too then huh?  Your logic makes no sense what-so-ever.  The way you are saying it we should have all voted for and agreed with Obama and that just isn't gonna happen no matter who runs.  Think about it, the way you say it anyone who doesn't like this administration and didn't vote for him is racist since we all have about the same opinions about his policies.  That would make the blacks who didn't vote for him or agree with his policies traitors or uncle toms too.  Boy is this country in trouble with your way of thinking.  Guess a black conservative had better not run for president next election or the liberals will be racists, traitors, and uncle toms too if they disagree with him or her. 
Trump 2020

Exterminator

Quote from: me on July 19, 2013, 01:37:11 PM
I guess I've been a man hater and would be a woman hater if Hillary runs and wins too then huh?

Are you saying you dislike Hillary because of her policies?  Which policies are those, exactly?
Arguing with Christians is like playing chess with a pigeon.  No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, shit on the board and strut around like it's victorious.

The truth is slow, but relentless. Over time it becomes irresistible.