Global Warming

[me]

What? You don't care to address this?

There are still things that can be done without raising tax's and throwing good money after bad.  The money raised will never get spent the way it was intended and then we will be taxed again.  If the people keep letting the government devise ways to take our money away from us we will soon be working entirely for the government and not be allowed to keep any of our wages.  Think about it.  How many new tax's are already being proposed and Obama's term hasn't even started yet. On one hand he's talking tax reductions and on the other hand Congress is figuring out a way to take the tax reduction from us by adding different types of tax's and most of the public is only hearing "tax reduction".   What does that have to do with this you ask...Well, aren't they talking about raising tax's and charging extra for different types of energy consumption?  Gas tax, cow fart tax, wheel tax...and on and on and on.....

[Exterminator]

This whole tax issue is nothing more than another BS smoke screen devised to further cloud the issue of global warming.  To the best of my knowledge, no one is seriously considering the types of taxes you people are claiming and emissions credits have been is use for decades.

[Henry Hawk]

This whole tax issue is nothing more than another BS smoke screen devised to further cloud the issue of global warming.  To the best of my knowledge, no one is seriously considering the types of taxes you people are claiming and emissions credits have been is use for decades.

there has been alot of talk by those from the kyoto protocol to leaders in europe, in proposing a world wide carbon tax.......they want developed countries to pay billions of $$ and to supply technology fpr climate related studies and projects........ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kyoto_Protocol

what makes you think it is smoke and mirrors?.......it is going to cost a great deal to do the things they want to do.......and WHO is going to pay for it?..............you can bet the U.S will be right at the top of the list as $$ donors....and the only way to do that is TAX the American workers....

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2007/nov/17/climatechange.carbonemissions

[Exterminator]

Did I already say bullshit?

[Henry Hawk]

Did I already say bullshit?

how and who is going to pay for ALL this Mr. EX?

[Bo D]

There are still things that can be done without raising tax's and throwing good money after bad.  The money raised will never get spent the way it was intended and then we will be taxed again.  If the people keep letting the government devise ways to take our money away from us we will soon be working entirely for the government and not be allowed to keep any of our wages.  Think about it.  How many new tax's are already being proposed and Obama's term hasn't even started yet. On one hand he's talking tax reductions and on the other hand Congress is figuring out a way to take the tax reduction from us by adding different types of tax's and most of the public is only hearing "tax reduction".   What does that have to do with this you ask...Well, aren't they talking about raising tax's and charging extra for different types of energy consumption?  Gas tax, cow fart tax, wheel tax...and on and on and on.....

You still didn't address the fact that a source you used to debunk global warming is really an advocate of acting "on the recommendations of Gore and the IPCC because if we do not reduce emissions of greenhouse gases and the climate models are right, the planet as we know it will in this century become unsustainable."

How can you, in good conscience, keep using partial quotes, veterinarians, ontologists, chemists, geologists, etc., to support your side?

Instead of posting from other blogs and forums, perhaps you should go to the source and see what was really said ..


Atmospheric Scientist Dr. Joanne Simpson
What should we as a nation do? Decisions have to be made on incomplete information. In this case, we must act on the recommendations of Gore and the IPCC because if we do not reduce emissions of greenhouse gases and the climate models are right, the planet as we know it will in this century become unsustainable.

http://climatesci.org/2008/02/27/trmm-tropical-rainfall-measuring-mission-data-set-potential-in-climate-controversy-by-joanne-simpson-private-citizen/

[me]

Where among these names do you see anyone who would not be qualified?  You seemed to think some of them were qualified when some of them were on the other side.

"Since I am no longer affiliated with any organization nor receiving any funding, I can speak quite frankly....As a scientist I remain skeptical...The main basis of the claim that man's release of greenhouse gases is the cause of the warming is based almost entirely upon climate models. We all know the frailty of models concerning the air-surface system." - Atmospheric Scientist Dr. Joanne Simpson, the first woman in the world to receive a PhD in meteorology, and formerly of NASA, who has authored more than 190 studies and has been called "among the most preeminent scientists of the last 100 years."



Warming fears are the "worst scientific scandal in the history...When people come to know what the truth is, they will feel deceived by science and scientists." - UN IPCC Japanese Scientist Dr. Kiminori Itoh, an award-winning PhD environmental physical chemist.



"The IPCC has actually become a closed circuit; it doesn't listen to others. It doesn't have open minds... I am really amazed that the Nobel Peace Prize has been given on scientifically incorrect conclusions by people who are not geologists." - Indian geologist Dr. Arun D. Ahluwalia at Punjab University and a board member of the UN-supported International Year of the Planet.



"So far, real measurements give no ground for concern about a catastrophic future warming." -  Scientist Dr. Jarl R. Ahlbeck, a chemical engineer at Abo Akademi University in Finland, author of 200 scientific publications and former Greenpeace member.



"Anyone who claims that the debate is over and the conclusions are firm has a fundamentally unscientific approach to one of the most momentous issues of our time."  - Solar physicist Dr. Pal Brekke, senior advisor to the Norwegian Space Centre in Oslo. Brekke has published more than 40 peer-reviewed scientific articles on the sun and solar interaction with the Earth.

"The models and forecasts of the UN IPCC "are incorrect because they only are based on mathematical models and presented results at scenarios that do not include, for example, solar activity." - Victor Manuel Velasco Herrera, a researcher at the Institute of Geophysics of the National Autonomous University of Mexico
  "It is a blatant lie put forth in the media that makes it seem there is only a fringe of scientists who don't buy into anthropogenic global warming." - U.S Government Atmospheric Scientist Stanley B. Goldenberg of the Hurricane Research Division of NOAA.   

"Even doubling or tripling the amount of carbon dioxide will virtually have little impact, as water vapour and water condensed on particles as clouds dominate the worldwide scene and always will." – . Geoffrey G. Duffy, a professor in the Department of Chemical and Materials Engineering of the University of Auckland, NZ.


"After reading [UN IPCC chairman] Pachauri's asinine comment [comparing skeptics to] Flat Earthers, it's hard to remain quiet." - Climate statistician Dr. William M. Briggs, who specializes in the statistics of forecast evaluation, serves on the American Meteorological Society's Probability and Statistics Committee and is an Associate Editor of Monthly Weather Review.


"The Kyoto theorists have put the cart before the horse. It is global warming that triggers higher levels of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere, not the other way round...A large number of critical documents submitted at the 1995 U.N. conference in Madrid vanished without a trace. As a result, the discussion was one-sided and heavily biased, and the U.N. declared global warming to be a scientific fact," Andrei Kapitsa, a Russian geographer and Antarctic ice core researcher.


"I am convinced that the current alarm over carbon dioxide is mistaken...Fears about man-made global warming are unwarranted and are not based on good science." - Award Winning Physicist Dr. Will Happer, Professor at the Department of Physics at Princeton University and Former Director of Energy Research at the Department of Energy, who has published over 200 scientific papers, and is a fellow of the American Physical Society, The American Association for the Advancement of Science, and the National Academy of Sciences.



"Nature's regulatory instrument is water vapor: more carbon dioxide leads to less moisture in the air, keeping the overall GHG content in accord with the necessary balance conditions." – Prominent Hungarian Physicist and environmental researcher Dr. Miklós Zágoni reversed his view of man-made warming and is now a skeptic. Zágoni was once Hungary's most outspoken supporter of the Kyoto Protocol.


"For how many years must the planet cool before we begin to understand that the planet is not warming? For how many years must cooling go on?" - Geologist Dr. David Gee the chairman of the science committee of the 2008 International Geological Congress who has authored 130 plus peer reviewed papers, and is currently at Uppsala University in Sweden.


"Gore prompted me to start delving into the science again and I quickly found myself solidly in the skeptic camp...Climate models can at best be useful for explaining climate changes after the fact." - Meteorologist Hajo Smit of Holland, who reversed his belief in man-made warming to become a skeptic, is a former member of the Dutch UN IPCC committee.

[Bo D]

Where among these names do you see anyone who would not be qualified?  You seemed to think some of them were qualified when some of them were on the other side.

Warming fears are the "worst scientific scandal in the history...When people come to know what the truth is, they will feel deceived by science and scientists." - UN IPCC Japanese Scientist Dr. Kiminori Itoh, an award-winning PhD environmental physical chemist.

We aren't studying CHEMISTRY.

"The IPCC has actually become a closed circuit; it doesn't listen to others. It doesn't have open minds... I am really amazed that the Nobel Peace Prize has been given on scientifically incorrect conclusions by people who are not geologists." - Indian geologist Dr. Arun D. Ahluwalia at Punjab University and a board member of the UN-supported International Year of the Planet.

We aren't studying GEOLOGY.

"So far, real measurements give no ground for concern about a catastrophic future warming." -  Scientist Dr. Jarl R. Ahlbeck, a chemical engineer at Abo Akademi University in Finland, author of 200 scientific publications and former Greenpeace member.

We aren't studying CHEMICAL ENGINEERING.

"Anyone who claims that the debate is over and the conclusions are firm has a fundamentally unscientific approach to one of the most momentous issues of our time."  - Solar physicist Dr. Pal Brekke, senior advisor to the Norwegian Space Centre in Oslo. Brekke has published more than 40 peer-reviewed scientific articles on the sun and solar interaction with the Earth.

There are some who believe that the Sun also has some part in global warming. As he says, we will see. I'm surprised you don't understand that he is essentially saying you are wrong if you firmly and truly believe that global warming is a hoax.




etc., etc., etc.

But I saved the best for last....

"Since I am no longer affiliated with any organization nor receiving any funding, I can speak quite frankly....As a scientist I remain skeptical...The main basis of the claim that man's release of greenhouse gases is the cause of the warming is based almost entirely upon climate models. We all know the frailty of models concerning the air-surface system." - Atmospheric Scientist Dr. Joanne Simpson, the first woman in the world to receive a PhD in meteorology, and formerly of NASA, who has authored more than 190 studies and has been called "among the most preeminent scientists of the last 100 years."

And she goes on to say....

What should we as a nation do? Decisions have to be made on incomplete information. In this case, we must act on the recommendations of Gore and the IPCC because if we do not reduce emissions of greenhouse gases and the climate models are right, the planet as we know it will in this century become unsustainable.[/size]

http://climatesci.org/2008/02/27/trmm-tropical-rainfall-measuring-mission-data-set-potential-in-climate-controversy-by-joanne-simpson-private-citizen/



(Didn't you read this the last two times I posted it?)

[me]

We aren't studying CHEMISTRY.


We aren't studying GEOLOGY.

Who would be better able to check for certain type changes in the earth than a geologist?

We aren't studying CHEMICAL ENGINEERING.

Who better would know what certain chemicals might do to the atmosphere than a chemist?




There are some who believe that the Sun also has some part in global warming. As he says, we will see. I'm surprised you don't understand that he is essentially saying you are wrong if you firmly and truly believe that global warming is a hoax.

We cannot control the suns orbit and it does play a part in the temp of the earth and different weather cycles.




etc., etc., etc.

But I saved the best for last....

And she goes on to say....

What should we as a nation do? Decisions have to be made on incomplete information. In this case, we must act on the recommendations of Gore and the IPCC because if we do not reduce emissions of greenhouse gases and the climate models are right, the planet as we know it will in this century become unsustainable.[/size]

http://climatesci.org/2008/02/27/trmm-tropical-rainfall-measuring-mission-data-set-potential-in-climate-controversy-by-joanne-simpson-private-citizen/



(Didn't you read this the last two times I posted it?)

he main basis of the claim that man's release of greenhouse gases is the cause of the warming is based almost entirely upon climate models. We all know the frailty of models concerning the air-surface system.

I read this part and that don't say to me that we should be willing to hand over our hard earned dollars to a government that will not spend it on what it is intended for and nothing will change.

[Henry Hawk]

And she goes on to say....

What should we as a nation do? Decisions have to be made on incomplete information. In this case, we must act on the recommendations of Gore and the IPCC because if we do not reduce emissions of greenhouse gases and the climate models are right, the planet as we know it will in this century become unsustainable.[/size]

and THEN, she goes ont to say.............."But as a scientist I remain skeptical."

decision have to be made on "incomplete information...".....and IF...."the climate models are right"

here is a full quote from her...:
"Since I am no longer affiliated with any organization nor receiving any funding, I can speak quite frankly....As a scientist I remain skeptical...The main basis of the claim that man's release of greenhouse gases is the cause of the warming is based almost entirely upon climate models. We all know the frailty of models concerning the air-surface system." -




and maybe these guys are NOT 'climatologists"........their opinions and conclusions are STILL something to ponder, and should NOT be disregarded all together....

another just to point out.............the IPCC predicted warming trends...but temperatures went (and are going) down while CO2 increased...

[Bo D]

I read this part and that don't say to me that we should be willing to hand over our hard earned dollars to a government that will not spend it on what it is intended for and nothing will change.

Selective reading at its best! You just confirmed what X and I have been stating. You have made up your "mind" based on all the junk e-mails in your inbox and reading blogs of completely unqualified hacks.

[Bo D]

and THEN, she goes ont to say.............."But as a scientist I remain skeptical."

decision have to be made on "incomplete information...".....and IF...."the climate models are right"

here is a full quote from her...:
"Since I am no longer affiliated with any organization nor receiving any funding, I can speak quite frankly....As a scientist I remain skeptical...The main basis of the claim that man's release of greenhouse gases is the cause of the warming is based almost entirely upon climate models. We all know the frailty of models concerning the air-surface system." -




and maybe these guys are NOT 'climatologists"........their opinions and conclusions are STILL something to ponder, and should NOT be disregarded all together....

another just to point out.............the IPCC predicted warming trends...but temperatures went (and are going) down while CO2 increased...

Skeptical is fine. Denial is wrong.

She does say "IF...the climate models are right"

She doesn't claim they are wrong. and the more complete quote is "if we do not reduce emissions of greenhouse gases and the climate models are right, the planet as we know it will in this century become unsustainable."

No...those guys aren't climatologists. And I don't go to a proctologist to get my teeth cleaned. And I don't consult my family doctor for tax advice.

[me]

Selective reading at its best! You just confirmed what X and I have been stating. You have made up your "mind" based on all the junk e-mails in your inbox and reading blogs of completely unqualified hacks.

And you have failed to explain how raising our tax's is going to help.  I am not basing what I am saying on junk emails and blogs I am basing it on seeing how the government has handled our tax dollars in the past and continues to handle our tax dollars. 

[Bo D]

And you have failed to explain how raising our tax's is going to help.  I am not basing what I am saying on junk emails and blogs I am basing it on seeing how the government has handled our tax dollars in the past and continues to handle our tax dollars. 

I am not discussing taxes. I am discussing the fact that global warming is real.

[me]

I am not discussing taxes. I am discussing the fact that global warming is real.

Based on hypothetical figures plugged into a computer by climatologists who were being paid to find certain results.