A large number of Americans have elected to dump their credit cards over the last few years. As the economy has tanked, consumers have begun reducing the amount of debt they carry and a large portion of us have started paying for our things via cash; and the lions share of those transactions have involved the use of our debit cards.
As Wall Street reforms impacted creditors and the fees and amounts they can charge for interest on their cards, banks have increasingly begun charging customers for transactions that historically were complimentary, and even at the gas pumps there is now a limit on how much you can place onto a single transaction. 75 bucks is the most common I have seen.
Now, banks across the country are starting to implement limits to the amounts of transactions that may be made with our debit cards. JPMorgan Chase, one of the nation's largest banks, is considering capping debit card transactions at either $50 or $100, and according to what I am hearing most of the banks in the US are also considering doing the very same thing!
So now its not only when you go to the pump and ring up 100 dollars in a fuel purchase, that you'll have to do two separate transactions, but virtually everywhere you go now!!!!! :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:
That's what happens when you get the government involved in the banks business. They had to make up for the new rules the Obama bunch put into effect to "protect consumers" some way and that was it.
Quote from: me on March 10, 2011, 02:12:32 PM
That's what happens when you get the government involved in the banks business. They had to make up for the new rules the Obama bunch put into effect to "protect consumers" some way and that was it.
So, let me get this straight. . . you are blaming the POTUS for overhauling the financial district in order to prevent another economic depression and national financial collapse? :confused: The very same banks and financial institutions whose out of control spending and lending led to the crises in the first place????
Where JPMorganChase is concerned, the changes resulted in a reduction of 1 billion from the billion
S they make EACH year on debit card transactions. This is just their way of recouping that BILLION each year via enforcement of draconian policy.
When my banks enact these policies I am going to put my debit cards into the safe, and only take them out when I have to obtain some cash after hours. PERIOD. And when a bank begins offering policies that are more in line with the way things are today, I will move EVERYTHING from the banks that don't.
In addition, I'll begin using my AMEX to charge anything I can, and then write one check every month to pay it all off. ANd if they don't accept AMEX and I don't have the cash, guess I don't need whatever it was I was going to purchase! (Note: AMEX typically charges retailers a larger percentage of each transaction compared to traditional credit cards and debit cards). They can kiss my ass if they think I am going to just accept their draconian policies!
Unintended consequences of something enacted trying to "protect" and not being thought out.
Quote from: me on March 10, 2011, 04:27:28 PM
Unintended consequences of something enacted trying to "protect" and not being thought out.
"Unintended" being the operative word, and banks are just getting themselves in more hot water if they think this is the answer to continuing profits on the backs of their customers. . .
Quote from: me on March 10, 2011, 02:12:32 PM
That's what happens when you get the government involved in the banks business. They had to make up for the new rules the Obama bunch put into effect to "protect consumers" some way and that was it.
Along time ago. "ME" said she didn't care how much the corporations or business charged for their products or services. I got to say one thing she still true to her word. Let the business screw us to death. Let they over charged us with fees and penalties. "ME" doesn't believe in fairness. :rolleyes: :razz:
Quote from: Palehorse on March 10, 2011, 05:02:22 PM
"Unintended" being the operative word, and banks are just getting themselves in more hot water if they think this is the answer to continuing profits on the backs of their customers. . .
And it is worse now than it was because the ones it is hurting are the ones who pay their bills in a timely manner and use the cards only for emergencies. It did help those who are constantly delinquent and over charge all the time though. I've always figured if I didn't have the money in the bank I didn't need to spend it though so no debit credit card for me. :biggrin:
Quote from: me on March 10, 2011, 10:00:50 PM
And it is worse now than it was because the ones it is hurting are the ones who pay their bills in a timely manner and use the cards only for emergencies. It did help those who are constantly delinquent and over charge all the time though. I've always figured if I didn't have the money in the bank I didn't need to spend it though so no debit credit card for me. :biggrin:
You're right things are bad, so many without a job and so many who have had their hours cut and wage cuts. But the credit card companies were really taking advantage of their power. You know what they were going was wrong.
But people shouldn't use their credit cards to live on and you know it. It causes them to get deeper and deeper in debt a hole they cannot get out of. If they had admitted they were broke sooner and asked for "government" help they would have been in better shape than being so deeply in debt. Some of these people are $30,000 to $40,000 in debt on credit cards.
I'm glad Obama put a stop to the predatory banks and their credit cards.
Quote from: The Troll on March 11, 2011, 07:10:53 AM
You're right things are bad, so many without a job and so many who have had their hours cut and wage cuts. But the credit card companies were really taking advantage of their power. You know what they were going was wrong.
But people shouldn't use their credit cards to live on and you know it. It causes them to get deeper and deeper in debt a hole they cannot get out of. If they had admitted they were broke sooner and asked for "government" help they would have been in better shape than being so deeply in debt. Some of these people are $30,000 to $40,000 in debt on credit cards.
I'm glad Obama put a stop to the predatory banks and their credit cards.
IT IS NOT UP TO THE GOVERNMENT TO HELP PEOPLE GET OUT OF DEBT!!!!!!! In case you didn't notice people have been in debt with credit cards for years and it is no ones fault but their own period. The fees and charges on those cards were meant to discourage people from making payments late and over charging but they did it anyway even when things were good because they "had to have it now". When this administration said the credit card companies could no longer do that they had to go another route to make up for the money they were losing. There were already laws in effect to protect consumers from unfair interest and charges from back when loan companies were charging 25 to 30% interest and it seemed like they were compounding daily, or in some cases hourly. Now what we have is the people who abuse are getting by and the ones who don't are paying for it.
Quote from: me on March 11, 2011, 09:29:40 AM
IT IS NOT UP TO THE GOVERNMENT TO HELP PEOPLE GET OUT OF DEBT!!!!!!! In case you didn't notice people have been in debt with credit cards for years and it is no ones fault but their own period. The fees and charges on those cards were meant to discourage people from making payments late and over charging but they did it anyway even when things were good because they "had to have it now". When this administration said the credit card companies could no longer do that they had to go another route to make up for the money they were losing. There were already laws in effect to protect consumers from unfair interest and charges from back when loan companies were charging 25 to 30% interest and it seemed like they were compounding daily, or in some cases hourly. Now what we have is the people who abuse are getting by and the ones who don't are paying for it.
:no: :no: :no:
In case you haven't noticed, the laws surrounding bankruptcy, which were typically used as an escape hatch by those who used credit cards unwisely, have substantially changed. (Bush) (And the lion's share of those laws governing lending institutions did NOT apply to those extending credit cards).
The laws regulating credit cards were changed due to the abusive nature in which banks and credit institutions were treating their customers. It was worse than the loan companies in many cases! Moreover, the amounts they charged to the stores for each transaction were substantially abusive and unreasonable and they reaped multi billions from those alone, for each institution!
This same industry typically compensates its employees at or very near minimum wage levels, so the billions they reap (and reaped over the years) have gone directly to the bottom line. (If you don't believe that take a look at the job boards and view the adds for tellers at banks, and customer service reps at banks. McDonalds pays better!)
Debit cards have been marketed as "same as cash" right out of the gate, because they draw upon the balances in your accounts, and are an immediate debit to your balance. They represent an increased level of security to those who chose to conduct their business on a cash only basis, by enabling them to do so without having to risk carrying actual cash on their person and being robbed of it.
NOW, it seems that in order for these institutions to recoup the dollars they are losing due to the new regulations, they are going to restrict the ability of their customers to continue to use debit cards, as a means to penalize retailers by forcing multiple transactions.
In time, that will result in increased fees to users of debit cards, due to the increased number of transactions conducted every day. So, they'll be looking to smack users with additional account fees just like JPMorgan Chase is ALREADY doing! In fact they are going to increase those fees even further!
This is going to drive a HUGE negative impact to the way consumers conduct personal business, forcing many to carry hard cash, which in turn will increase the violent armed robberies when the miscreants realize people are carrying cash again.
Seriously, I am going to STOP using debit cards at all once they begin doing this. I got rid of credit cards YEARS ago, and only own one that I have kept for business travel. Looks like I'll be using that instead of a debit card at some point in the future. . .
Here's another potential issue with these new policies. . .
What about the people in the state of Indiana that are currently collecting unemployment? Those funds are no longer distributed via a check, but instead electronically deposited into an account for a debit card issued by PNC bank. . . :mad: :mad: :mad:
It does not have to be used as a debit card it can be used as a credit card with no fees.
You can thank Scott Brown and all the Democrats.
Quote from: me on March 11, 2011, 10:51:33 AM
It does not have to be used as a debit card it can be used as a credit card with no fees.
That's today. . . watch tomorrow.
Quote from: Doc on March 11, 2011, 11:30:02 AM
You can thank Scott Brown and all the Democrats.
And you sir/madam, are exactly what is wrong with this country.
Quote from: Palehorse on March 11, 2011, 11:52:09 AM
And you sir/madam, are exactly what is wrong with this country.
THAT is a bold statement and very Tollish, I might add.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on March 11, 2011, 11:57:30 AM
THAT is a bold statement and very Tollish, I might add.
So is injecting religious bullshit into a discussion of something else.
You've posted around me long enough to know if you shovel me shit you'll get a truckload in return.
Quote from: Palehorse on March 11, 2011, 11:59:15 AM
So is injecting religious bullshit into a discussion of something else.
You've posted around me long enough to know if you shovel me shit you'll get a truckload in return.
all he said was:
QuoteYou can thank Scott Brown and all the Democrats.
:confused: :rolleyes:
Quote from: Henry Hawk on March 11, 2011, 12:01:02 PM
all he said was:
:confused: :rolleyes:
Quote from: Doc on March 11, 2011, 11:35:15 AM
This is but a sip of the true flood of despair and destruction God can reign upon you
http://theunknownzone.us/smf/index.php?topic=17644.msg396379#new (http://theunknownzone.us/smf/index.php?topic=17644.msg396379#new)
Yeah. . . rigggght! :rolleyes:
S/he is nothing but a REAL troll, utilizing guerilla tactics in posting shite all over the place, then leaving. .
Palehorse he made one statement on another thread five minutes AFTER he made this one on this thread...
you just don't like doc, so you jump on him.
that's the way I see it.....do what you want, I'm just making an observation....but, it reminded me of the Troll...that's all.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on March 11, 2011, 12:07:34 PM
Palehorse he made one statement on another thread five minutes AFTER he made this one on this thread...
you just don't like doc, so you jump on him.
that's the way I see it.....do what you want, I'm just making an observation....but, it reminded me of the Troll...that's all.
Nice. . . thank you. . . :rolleyes:
Quote from: Henry Hawk on March 11, 2011, 12:07:34 PM
Palehorse he made one statement on another thread five minutes AFTER he made this one on this thread...
you just don't like doc, so you jump on him.
that's the way I see it.....do what you want, I'm just making an observation....but, it reminded me of the Troll...that's all.
I don't see one name being called. He made an observation and offered an opinion about another opinion.
That's a ranting attack?
Hmmm. Gotta rethink what I've observed in the past myself.
Quote from: followsthewolf on March 11, 2011, 01:38:55 PM
I don't see one name being called. He made an observation and offered an opinion about another opinion.
That's a ranting attack?
Hmmm. Gotta rethink what I've observed in the past myself.
I never said he had a ranting attack......I just made an observation after PH said HE (Doc) is what is wrong with this country...I think that is kind of harsh, but I guess I should just stay out of it.
PTSD (Posting Traumatic Stress Disorder) :biggrin:
There's more to this than meets the eye ....
Here's the issue. When merchants or service providers accept a credit card, charge card or debit card, they have to pay what's called an interchange, or swipe, fee. This can average 2 to 3 percent of the purchase's price for credit cards and 1 to 2 percent for debit cards each time a card is used to cover a transaction, according to the National Retail Federation.
For years, merchants have complained that the fees are excessive and drive up their prices, which they have to pass on to all customers. But retailers have put up with them because they know that consumers spend more when they use plastic, even their debit cards.
In what was billed as a pro-consumer move, Congress decided, as part of the Dodd-Frank Wall Street Reform and Consumer Protection Act, to require the Federal Reserve to set standards to lower the fees. The law says swipe fees should be "reasonable and proportional to the cost incurred by the issuer."
Merchants were elated; bankers, not so much.
The Federal Reserve proposed capping the fees at 12 cents per transaction, more than 70 percent lower than the 2009 average. The Fed also said it would look at an adjustment to the fees to reflect certain issuer costs associated with fraud prevention. The Fed's final ruling is due next month.
Large banks claim that they will lose more than $12 billion in revenue if the Fed's proposal becomes final. Over the past decade, debit card payments have grown more than any other form of electronic payment, increasing to 37.9 billion transactions in 2009, according to the Federal Reserve. In 2009, debit card interchange fees totaled more than $16 billion.
With so much money at stake, the financial services industry and the companies that process debit card payments are lobbying hard to get Congress to revisit the law and do away with the proposed cap, allowing them to continue charging what they want.
An ad campaign funded by the Electronic Payments Coalition, which includes credit unions, banks and payment card networks, is trying to win over consumers to their side. One print ad, with an empty brown wallet to catch your eye, reads: "A new regulation will make your debit card more expensive, less convenient, or disappear altogether. Giant retailers lobbied hard for this rule because they wanted you - instead of them - to foot the bill for using your debit card."
The ad carries the tag line "Washington is helping you clean out your wallet."
Now, the fact is that retailers already pass along the interchange fees to consumers in the form of higher prices. And it's the debit card issuers who will make your cards more expensive or less convenient. To cover lost revenue from lower swipe fees, the financial institutions say they may have to impose annual fees for debit card users or raise fees for other banking services. Some may stop offering debit cards to customers.
The card issuers can threaten to increase fees - and follow through on those threats - because they have already gotten you to think that debit cards are so much better than using cash. In fact, some of you even believe that using your debit card is the same as using cash. (By the way, it isn't.)
So it appears we can't win this fight. Even with lower swipe fees, there's no guarantee that merchants would lower retail prices to reflect the break they would be getting.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/03/09/AR2011030905113.html (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/03/09/AR2011030905113.html)
Exactly Olias. Consumers are screwed no matter what they do; even if they refuse to use debit cards/ credit cards - you are still paying for it.
we were screwed all along...we are just more aware of it now...and now they will revise on the way they are screwing us...nothing is changing to help us.
Whqt is wrong with just writing a check?
Quote from: Anne on March 11, 2011, 05:58:24 PM
Whqt is wrong with just writing a check?
Don't think that is exempt. They'll be charging per check too once the figure out that consumers have stopped using debit cards.
To an early comment about using a debit card as a credit card; a lot of retailers do not accept debit cards under a credit transactions. . .
Quote from: Henry Hawk on March 11, 2011, 11:57:30 AM
THAT is a bold statement and very Tollish, I might add.
Wow! Troll is becoming a Verb, thank you Herry Fhawk.
Quote from: Anne on March 11, 2011, 05:58:24 PM
Whqt is wrong with just writing a check?
My wife said just today, that if they raised the fees on the cards any more she going to write checks. Your right of this one Anne> :smile:
Quote from: Palehorse on March 11, 2011, 06:57:47 PM
Don't think that is exempt. They'll be charging per check too once the figure out that consumers have stopped using debit cards.
To an early comment about using a debit card as a credit card; a lot of retailers do not accept debit cards under a credit transactions. . .
We belong to a credit union and really have not had any fees on any of our transactions, including atms.
Quote from: Anne on March 11, 2011, 08:43:53 PM
We belong to a credit union and really have not had any fees on any of our transactions, including atms.
Yup. Same here.
Quote from: Nighthawk on March 11, 2011, 10:42:16 PM
Yup. Same here.
is this a republican thing?.....because I do too, and have NO fees whatsoever either.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on March 11, 2011, 10:43:51 PM
is this a republican thing?.....because I do too, and have NO fees whatsoever either.
Might be because I don't have any fees on my debit/credit card either.
Keep crowing. . .
Quote from: Henry Hawk on March 11, 2011, 10:43:51 PM
is this a republican thing?.....because I do too, and have NO fees whatsoever either.
With Henry Fhawk, it's being cheap. Just like he doesn't want to pay public workers and school teacher a living wage with his taxes. Like he pays so much. I really don't mind paying for plubic workers and teachers. I would rather pay the workers than pay a private company who you have to pay profit and pay it's owner, REALLY BIG MONEY.
:fireworks: :bliss: :chick: :bliss: :fireworks:
Henry Fhawk
There are lots of credit unions around, Madison County CU, Independent CU, and Lampco FCU just tomane three I know about in Anderson. They are not as restrictive about who belongs to them as they used to be. They were limited on the types of business they could do at one time but again they can do more now. I don't thing they used to be able to make home loans but can now.
Quote from: Henry Hawk on March 11, 2011, 01:44:22 PM
I never said he had a ranting attack......I just made an observation after PH said HE (Doc) is what is wrong with this country...I think that is kind of harsh, but I guess I should just stay out of it.
Yep, Henry Fhawk you have got so tender. Such thin skin. But just like you say, what ever. :wink: :smile:
Quote from: Henry Hawk on March 11, 2011, 10:43:51 PM
is this a republican thing?.....because I do too, and have NO fees whatsoever either.
Henry, I can't believe you belonging to a "Credit Union" a union of people trying to better their lives. They were formed for the poorer people who the big banks would not have any dealings. Providing good banking service at no or little cost to their members. 8)
I just disappointed in you Henry. But I can see why you consider belonging to a "Credit Union" To get anything FREE. :rolleyes: No union dues. :rotfl: :rotfl:
Quote from: The Troll on March 12, 2011, 07:45:19 PM
Henry, I can't believe you belonging to a "Credit Union" a union of people trying to better their lives. They were formed for the poorer people who the big banks would not have any dealings. Providing good banking service at no or little cost to their members. 8)
I just disappointed in you Henry. But I can see why you consider belonging to a "Credit Union" To get anything FREE. :rolleyes: No union dues. :rotfl: :rotfl:
Now remember "I" am the one who worked for a living ... an honest pay for an honest day....NOT, the one's who got a day's pay for a unions say....talk about freebies... :rotfl:
Quote from: Henry Hawk on March 12, 2011, 11:48:44 PM
Now remember "I" am the one who worked for a living ... an honest pay for an honest day....NOT, the one's who got a day's pay for a unions say....talk about freebies... :rotfl:
Yeah, like you work so hard everyday. :wink: :smile: